From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Jul 2 09:42:35 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2007 15:12:35 +0530 Subject: rotating banners, first idea In-Reply-To: <466588C5.9040907@redhat.com> References: <20070605085524.AA118735E6@hormel.redhat.com> <466588C5.9040907@redhat.com> Message-ID: <4688C88B.1000306@fedoraproject.org> M?ir?n Duffy wrote: > chasd wrote: >> All layouts need "breathing space" however that top area is prime >> visual real estate. I think adding a tag line to that area would >> benefit the layout ( of all the pages, even if no banner is used ). > > What do you think about having some promos/banners/etc that have very > strict visual style guidelines (eg must have a particular light-colored > background and a particular (let's say light grey) foreground in this > area? See the updated new-mock-2 (and squint and pretend the dj promo is > much much lighter :) ): > > http://linuxgrrl.com/misc/new-mock-2.png Are you still planning on using these promos? This discussion went quiet. Rahul From mspevack at redhat.com Mon Jul 2 20:18:06 2007 From: mspevack at redhat.com (Max Spevack) Date: Mon, 2 Jul 2007 16:18:06 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Reminder -- Vote in the Fedora Board election Message-ID: I would like to remind everyone to vote in the Fedora Board elections, which are currently ongoing. If you are getting this message multiple times, I'm sorry. It's being sent to various lists. The Fedora Board's membership changes on a rotating basis. This election is for 3 of the 9 Fedora Board seats. The Fedora Board is the Fedora Project's "executive committee" and is ultimately accountable for everything that happens within Fedora, and delegates responsibillity to various sub-projects accordingly. Information about the candidates and voting is available here: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Board/Elections Voting will end at 11:59 PM UTC on Sunday July 8th. Anyone who has signed the Fedora CLA is eligible to vote. Thank you, Max -- Max Spevack + http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MaxSpevack + gpg key -- http://spevack.org/max.asc + fingerprint -- CD52 5E72 369B B00D 9E9A 773E 2FDB CB46 5A17 CF21 From luya_tfz at thefinalzone.com Tue Jul 3 17:45:23 2007 From: luya_tfz at thefinalzone.com (Luya Tshimbalanga) Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2007 10:45:23 -0700 Subject: PC Advisor: Fedora 7.0 Linux distribution Message-ID: <468A8B33.3070508@thefinalzone.com> http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/reviews/index.cfm?reviewid=1003 "Fedora is solid, and the people who use it and hack on it love it. We think, however, that Ubuntu, because of its different focus, ends up being a more inviting environment for Linux newcomers." It looks like the review is heavily biased toward Ubuntu used as reference. However, it raises some interesting points like the inconsistency of the name of items inside the menu panel. Luya From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Tue Jul 3 17:48:34 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2007 23:18:34 +0530 Subject: Fedora 7.0 Linux distribution: Review in PC Advisor Message-ID: <468A8BF2.8000206@fedoraproject.org> Hi "Like everything else, this arrangement is a result of Fedora's focus: Fedora is very Free Software-centric - far more so than Ubuntu, which ships with some proprietary components (including 3D graphics drivers) that Fedora steadfastly eschews on principle." http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/reviews/index.cfm?reviewid=1003&pn=1 Rahul From luya_tfz at thefinalzone.com Tue Jul 3 18:07:49 2007 From: luya_tfz at thefinalzone.com (Luya Tshimbalanga) Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2007 11:07:49 -0700 Subject: Fedora 7.0 Linux distribution: Review in PC Advisor In-Reply-To: <468A8BF2.8000206@fedoraproject.org> References: <468A8BF2.8000206@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <468A9075.7080904@thefinalzone.com> Rahul Sundaram a ?crit : > Hi > > "Like everything else, this arrangement is a result of Fedora's focus: > Fedora is very Free Software-centric - far more so than Ubuntu, which > ships with some proprietary components (including 3D graphics drivers) > that Fedora steadfastly eschews on principle." > > http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/reviews/index.cfm?reviewid=1003&pn=1 > > Rahul > Looks like I have beaten you this time. =p -- ??D0 References: <468A8BF2.8000206@fedoraproject.org> <468A9075.7080904@thefinalzone.com> Message-ID: <468A90E2.9000409@fedoraproject.org> Luya Tshimbalanga wrote: > Rahul Sundaram a ?crit : >> Hi >> >> "Like everything else, this arrangement is a result of Fedora's focus: >> Fedora is very Free Software-centric - far more so than Ubuntu, which >> ships with some proprietary components (including 3D graphics drivers) >> that Fedora steadfastly eschews on principle." >> >> http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/reviews/index.cfm?reviewid=1003&pn=1 >> >> Rahul >> > Looks like I have beaten you this time. =p Yep. I came across this review a while back. Just been lazy to post it. Rahul From tchung at fedoraproject.org Tue Jul 3 20:16:26 2007 From: tchung at fedoraproject.org (Thomas Chung) Date: Tue, 3 Jul 2007 13:16:26 -0700 Subject: Fedora 7.0 Linux distribution: Review in PC Advisor In-Reply-To: <468A90E2.9000409@fedoraproject.org> References: <468A8BF2.8000206@fedoraproject.org> <468A9075.7080904@thefinalzone.com> <468A90E2.9000409@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <369bce3b0707031316oe242c6bxd80063b587cb0d58@mail.gmail.com> On 7/3/07, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Luya Tshimbalanga wrote: > > Looks like I have beaten you this time. =p > > Yep. I came across this review a while back. Just been lazy to post it. > > Rahul However, I like the quote from Rahul. It's more positive statement for Fedora Community. :) Regards, -- Thomas Chung http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasChung From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Wed Jul 4 10:20:49 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2007 15:50:49 +0530 Subject: Fedora 7 - A Review Message-ID: <468B7481.6010402@fedoraproject.org> Hi Short review but does mention the new SELinux management tool most reviews haven't looked at. http://shiftbackspace.com/2007/06/10/fedora-7-a-review/ "After writing this entire review while using Fedora 7, I feel much better about it. I am thoroughly impressed by the offering supported in part by Red Hat and the community involved. Unfortunately, the choice to use only non-proprietary software makes this distribution more difficult to use ?out-of-the-box?. However, I whole-heartedly commend the Fedora team on ensuring that every aspect involved is within the free and open-source boundaries and any user who wants additional functions can easily get them using the yum installer. Another great thing Fedora has going for it is that so many applications are offered as easy-to-install .rpm (Red Hat package manager) files." Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Wed Jul 4 10:39:16 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2007 16:09:16 +0530 Subject: Misconceptions About Red Hat's Kernel Patches Message-ID: <468B78D4.80705@fedoraproject.org> Hi Good blog to point to when talking about kernel patches in Fedora. http://osnews.com/comment.php?news_id=18195 "Talking with quite a few people at OLS last week, it seems there are still quite a few misconceptions about just how patched various kernels were throughout the history of Red Hat. One particularly egregious statement I heard was 'Early Red Hat kernels had ~2000 patches'. Here's some hard facts on exactly how many patches were in each release." Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Wed Jul 4 13:28:18 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2007 18:58:18 +0530 Subject: Fedora 7 (Moonshine) Final Message-ID: <468BA072.2060606@fedoraproject.org> Hi More of a set of notes rather than a review but here you go http://partha.com/fedora7-review-page1.html http://partha.com/fedora7-review-page2.html Rahul From tchung at fedoraproject.org Fri Jul 6 00:38:07 2007 From: tchung at fedoraproject.org (Thomas Chung) Date: Thu, 5 Jul 2007 17:38:07 -0700 Subject: Review: Flying High with Fedora 7 Message-ID: <369bce3b0707051738q151a09a5w8c959021e238820@mail.gmail.com> http://www.technetra.com/writings/archive/2007/07/01/review-fedora-7 "As their "Flying High" theme promises, Fedora 7 is indeed a great plane to fly. It is a first class distro that demonstrates solid progress in improving the user experience, easing the move to virtualization and enabling the user to create their own flying machine through custom build tools. So grab your flight gear and take Fedora 7 for a spin. See you onboard!" -- Thomas Chung http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasChung From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Fri Jul 6 03:44:34 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2007 09:14:34 +0530 Subject: A face-to-face conversation with Max Spevack of Fedora Message-ID: <468DBAA2.5070904@fedoraproject.org> Hi "In Fedora 8 and 9, over the next year let's say, we want to make the technology even better. For example, envision you take your whole computer around on your USB key and you stick it into any laptop and your desktop just appears. If you loose it, your data is encrypted, so it's not as much of a catastrophe as it could be ? at least your bank account is not all over the world." http://www.technetra.com/writings/archive/2007/07/01/face-to-face-with-max-spevack Rahul From sankarshan.mukhopadhyay at gmail.com Fri Jul 6 04:42:49 2007 From: sankarshan.mukhopadhyay at gmail.com (Sankarshan Mukhopadhyay) Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2007 10:12:49 +0530 Subject: Technetra | Review: Flying High with Fedora 7 Message-ID: <468DC849.90109@gmail.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 http://www.technetra.com/writings/archive/2007/07/01/review-fedora-7 Fedora 7 is a first class distro that demonstrates solid progress in improving the user experience, easing the move to virtualization and enabling the user to create their own custom spins with open source build tools. - -- You see things; and you say 'Why?'; But I dream things that never were; and I say 'Why not?' - George Bernard Shaw -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFGjchJXQZpNTcrCzMRAscbAJ9Zc/zLTQvIeqYivLgCS7ax9FS0HQCfcMBN +0Hi18ozaVzMQDdK8TURnPY= =Lb/A -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From sankarshan.mukhopadhyay at gmail.com Fri Jul 6 04:44:34 2007 From: sankarshan.mukhopadhyay at gmail.com (Sankarshan Mukhopadhyay) Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2007 10:14:34 +0530 Subject: Technetra | Review: Flying High with Fedora 7 In-Reply-To: <468DC849.90109@gmail.com> References: <468DC849.90109@gmail.com> Message-ID: <468DC8B2.7010001@gmail.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Sankarshan Mukhopadhyay wrote: > http://www.technetra.com/writings/archive/2007/07/01/review-fedora-7 > > Fedora 7 is a first class distro that demonstrates solid progress in > improving the user experience, easing the move to virtualization and > enabling the user to create their own custom spins with open source > build tools. > Umm...cough cough - sorry about this double post. Looks like ThomasC has pipped me to the post - -- You see things; and you say 'Why?'; But I dream things that never were; and I say 'Why not?' - George Bernard Shaw -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFGjciyXQZpNTcrCzMRAud/AJ9vZwPr8letc11XUkeTR/9x+t142QCggeWs 18U1JK69KOfYliqpdtrtorI= =8BV4 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From sankarshan.mukhopadhyay at gmail.com Fri Jul 6 04:45:20 2007 From: sankarshan.mukhopadhyay at gmail.com (Sankarshan Mukhopadhyay) Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2007 10:15:20 +0530 Subject: A face-to-face conversation with Max Spevack of Fedora In-Reply-To: <468DBAA2.5070904@fedoraproject.org> References: <468DBAA2.5070904@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <468DC8E0.4030204@gmail.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Rahul Sundaram wrote: If you loose it, your data is encrypted, so > it's not as much of a catastrophe loose (sic) it ? :) - -- You see things; and you say 'Why?'; But I dream things that never were; and I say 'Why not?' - George Bernard Shaw -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFGjcjgXQZpNTcrCzMRAuVsAKCf1PHmL548akKFkfjhFbaOr80/OQCgic9n LD7ll7PFa3tl0QE/fdn0o/U= =EwTJ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From tchung at fedoraproject.org Fri Jul 6 07:06:45 2007 From: tchung at fedoraproject.org (Thomas Chung) Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 00:06:45 -0700 Subject: Technetra | Review: Flying High with Fedora 7 In-Reply-To: <468DC8B2.7010001@gmail.com> References: <468DC849.90109@gmail.com> <468DC8B2.7010001@gmail.com> Message-ID: <369bce3b0707060006kab2619fi1162333e48e6deac@mail.gmail.com> On 7/5/07, Sankarshan Mukhopadhyay > Umm...cough cough - sorry about this double post. Looks like ThomasC has > pipped me to the post No problem. It's a good article and worth to mention twice. :) -- Thomas Chung http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasChung From rodrigopadula at gmail.com Sat Jul 7 03:04:30 2007 From: rodrigopadula at gmail.com (Rodrigo Padula) Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2007 00:04:30 -0300 Subject: Fedora Artwork - 3D Wallpappers Message-ID: <3668180e0707062004je3a4452q23f62e9fec78ca63@mail.gmail.com> Great Job! http://mola.c100c.com/index.php/photos/album/4.html Nice picture!! Fedora Island http://mola.c100c.com/index.php/photos/album/4/photo/20.html Rodrigo Padula de Oliveira Brazilian Fedora Project http://www.projetofedora.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Tue Jul 10 17:17:43 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 22:47:43 +0530 Subject: Fedora 7 KDE spin and Akademy Message-ID: <4693BF37.102@fedoraproject.org> Hi, Rex Dieter from the KDE SIG in Fedora gave a talk about the Fedora 7 KDE spin Akademy, the KDE conference. Apparently, Fedora is the only major distribution planning to include KDE 4 by default in the next version. http://akademy.kde.org/conference/talks/07.php Here is the video: http://akademy.kde.org/images/video.png Rahul From rdieter at math.unl.edu Tue Jul 10 20:15:43 2007 From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter) Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 15:15:43 -0500 Subject: Fedora 7 KDE spin and Akademy References: <4693BF37.102@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Rex Dieter from the KDE SIG in Fedora gave a talk about the Fedora 7 KDE > spin Akademy, the KDE conference. Apparently, Fedora is the only major > distribution planning to include KDE 4 by default in the next version. I'd qualify that as saying no one else has committed to it, yet, as we have anyway. > http://akademy.kde.org/conference/talks/07.php Link on: http://akademy.kde.org/conference/programme.php works a little better. :) -- Rex From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Thu Jul 12 22:21:46 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 03:51:46 +0530 Subject: =?windows-1252?q?How=92s_Fedora_7_Faring=3F?= Message-ID: <4696A97A.1040701@fedoraproject.org> Hi The statistics pages have more details but the uptake is pretty good so far. The smolt data is also pretty interesting. http://www.press.redhat.com/2007/07/03/hows-fedora-7-faring/ "It?s been about one month since the release of Fedora 7 and we thought it was time to give you a few updates. We?ve had over 300,000 installations of Fedora 7 in the first month since its release on May 31. That number is thus far pretty in-line with expectations, given that Fedora Core 6 received close to 400,000 installations in its first month, and we expect that people will wait a little while to upgrade their systems. Fedora keeps a statistics page with information about the newest releases if you?d like to learn more." Rahul From nicu_fedora at nicubunu.ro Fri Jul 13 06:04:58 2007 From: nicu_fedora at nicubunu.ro (Nicu Buculei) Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 09:04:58 +0300 Subject: =?utf-8?q?How=E2=80=99s_Fedora_7_Faring=3F?= In-Reply-To: <4696A97A.1040701@fedoraproject.org> References: <4696A97A.1040701@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4697160A.5010409@nicubunu.ro> Rahul Sundaram wrote: > > The statistics pages have more details but the uptake is pretty good so > far. The smolt data is also pretty interesting. > > > http://www.press.redhat.com/2007/07/03/hows-fedora-7-faring/ So anyone tries to speculate why F7 installs are at about 80% of the previous FC6 installs? Summer is not a good time when people update their distro? Is Fedora market share shrinking? Was FC6 such a good distro people hesitate to upgrade from? I would give myself a boring reply along the lines of "only two releases is not enough data to draw a conclusion about trends" but I also would like a bit of speculation. -- nicu :: http://nicubunu.ro :: http://nicubunu.blogspot.com Cool Fedora wallpapers: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro/wallpapers/ Open Clip Art Library: http://www.openclipart.org my Fedora stuff: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro From herlo at fedoraproject.org Fri Jul 13 13:05:35 2007 From: herlo at fedoraproject.org (Clint Savage) Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 07:05:35 -0600 Subject: =?utf-8?q?How=E2=80=99s_Fedora_7_Faring=3F?= In-Reply-To: <4697160A.5010409@nicubunu.ro> References: <4696A97A.1040701@fedoraproject.org> <4697160A.5010409@nicubunu.ro> Message-ID: <4697789F.3060607@fedoraproject.org> Nicu Buculei wrote: > Rahul Sundaram wrote: >> >> The statistics pages have more details but the uptake is pretty good >> so far. The smolt data is also pretty interesting. >> >> >> http://www.press.redhat.com/2007/07/03/hows-fedora-7-faring/ > > So anyone tries to speculate why F7 installs are at about 80% of the > previous FC6 installs? Summer is not a good time when people update > their distro? Is Fedora market share shrinking? Was FC6 such a good > distro people hesitate to upgrade from? > I would give myself a boring reply along the lines of "only two > releases is not enough data to draw a conclusion about trends" but I > also would like a bit of speculation. > Nicu, I, for one, am not seeing this result in my little world, although the statistics say its less adopted than FC6. As part of my job, I interact with 40-50 of people a month as a technical instructor. I casually state that I am a big Open Source guy and indeed a Fedora Ambassador. I offer up the LiveCDs and the DVDs regularly and they are snatched up amazingly fast. I think GNU/Linux (Fedora in this case) has always been a grass roots effort, and I've been treating it as such. The grass and roots have just gotten bigger. Cheers, Clint From marc at mwiriadi.id.au Mon Jul 16 16:27:48 2007 From: marc at mwiriadi.id.au (Marc Wiriadisastra) Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 00:27:48 +0800 Subject: =?utf-8?b?SG934oCZcw==?= Fedora 7 Faring? In-Reply-To: <4697789F.3060607@fedoraproject.org> References: <4696A97A.1040701@fedoraproject.org> <4697160A.5010409@nicubunu.ro> <4697789F.3060607@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <1184603268.3116.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 2007-07-13 at 07:05 -0600, Clint Savage wrote: > Nicu Buculei wrote: > > Rahul Sundaram wrote: > >> > >> The statistics pages have more details but the uptake is pretty good > >> so far. The smolt data is also pretty interesting. > >> > >> > >> http://www.press.redhat.com/2007/07/03/hows-fedora-7-faring/ > > > > So anyone tries to speculate why F7 installs are at about 80% of the > > previous FC6 installs? Summer is not a good time when people update > > their distro? Is Fedora market share shrinking? Was FC6 such a good > > distro people hesitate to upgrade from? > > I would give myself a boring reply along the lines of "only two > > releases is not enough data to draw a conclusion about trends" but I > > also would like a bit of speculation. > > > Nicu, > > I, for one, am not seeing this result in my little world, although the > statistics say its less adopted than FC6. As part of my job, I > interact with 40-50 of people a month as a technical instructor. I > casually state that I am a big Open Source guy and indeed a Fedora > Ambassador. I offer up the LiveCDs and the DVDs regularly and they are > snatched up amazingly fast. I think GNU/Linux (Fedora in this case) has > always been a grass roots effort, and I've been treating it as such. > The grass and roots have just gotten bigger. I know a lot of people haven't upgraded if they have ATI cards. The state of the ati drivers is horrible however the opensource drivers are improving. I wouldn't say that is the only reason however I would say thats a contributing factor. FC6 was very stable and while there are a few hickups with bugs thats always the case then by the end of the release fedora 7 will be stable and it will be back at square one. My $0.02 Marc From marc at mwiriadi.id.au Mon Jul 16 16:29:19 2007 From: marc at mwiriadi.id.au (Marc Wiriadisastra) Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 00:29:19 +0800 Subject: Smolt to be a Linux Thing Message-ID: <1184603359.3116.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> http://www.phoronix.com/?page=news_item&px=NTg5Ng "Smolt, the Linux hardware profiler that was introduced by the Fedora project for automatically reporting installed hardware and other system attributes, reached a new milestone last week and is in the process of another. Last week, Smolt reached 75,000 profiles for Fedora after being introduced back in January of this year. At the time of writing, there are now over 78,300 profiles." Kudo's go to the dev's Cheers, Marc From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Jul 16 23:09:01 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 04:39:01 +0530 Subject: Smolt to be a Linux Thing In-Reply-To: <1184603359.3116.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1184603359.3116.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <469BFA8D.9050507@fedoraproject.org> Marc Wiriadisastra wrote: > http://www.phoronix.com/?page=news_item&px=NTg5Ng > > "Smolt, the Linux hardware profiler that was introduced by the Fedora > project for automatically reporting installed hardware and other system > attributes, reached a new milestone last week and is in the process of > another. Last week, Smolt reached 75,000 profiles for Fedora after being > introduced back in January of this year. At the time of writing, there > are now over 78,300 profiles." > > Kudo's go to the dev's Some background on this: http://rahulsundaram.livejournal.com/11995.html Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Tue Jul 17 21:17:32 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2007 02:47:32 +0530 Subject: Proposed Fedora 8 Features Message-ID: <469D31EC.6050103@fedoraproject.org> Hi A pretty good look with screenshots and short descriptions though the list of features are a bit premature to say at this point. I think we can do something similar to officially while announcing the list of features for Fedora 8 which will happen when we hit feature freeze during the development cycle. http://linuxupdate.blogspot.com/2007/07/proposed-fedora-8-features.html Discussions at http://osnews.com/comment.php?news_id=18277 Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Wed Jul 18 00:30:12 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2007 06:00:12 +0530 Subject: New in Fedora: Jack Aboutboul Message-ID: <469D5F14.8040103@fedoraproject.org> Hi Jack Aboutboul talks about what's new and interesting in Fedora in a Linux World podcast with Don Marti. Why does the core/extras merge matter, custom spins of Fedora, relationship between Fedora and OLPC, KVM and virt-manager virtualization, does user space in Linux still suck like Dave Jones says it did, boot up speed and much more... http://www.linuxworld.com/podcasts/linux/2007/062507-linuxcast.html Rahul From rodrigopadula at gmail.com Thu Jul 19 14:04:58 2007 From: rodrigopadula at gmail.com (Rodrigo Padula) Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 11:04:58 -0300 Subject: Linus Torvalds: Fedora User Message-ID: <3668180e0707190704m3b6fda42q4f4a3622bcfdb789@mail.gmail.com> Interview with Linus Torvalds A curiosity: which is your favourite distribution, and which on e do you consider more secure? I don't really tend to care much, I've changed distributions over the years, and to me the most important thing tends to be that they are easy to install and upgrade, and allow me to do the only part I really care about - the kernel. So the only major distribution I've never used has actually been Debian, exactly because that has traditionally been harder to install. Which sounds kind of strange, since Debian is also considered to be the "hard-core technical" distribution, but that's literally exactly what I personally do * not* want in a distro. I'll take the nice ones with simple installers etc, because to me, that's the whole and only point of using a distribution in the first place. So I've used SuSE, Red Hat, Ubuntu, YDL (I ran my main setup on PowerPC-based machines for a while, and YDL - Yellow Dog Linux - ended up the easiest choice). Right now, most of my machines seem to have Fedora 7 on then, but that's only a statement of fact, not meant to be that I think it's necessarily "better" than the other distros. Link:http://www.oneopensource.it/interview-linus-torvalds/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From b.j.smith at ieee.org Thu Jul 19 14:31:30 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 10:31:30 -0400 Subject: Linus Torvalds: Fedora User In-Reply-To: <3668180e0707190704m3b6fda42q4f4a3622bcfdb789@mail.gmail.com> References: <3668180e0707190704m3b6fda42q4f4a3622bcfdb789@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1184855490.3267.10.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Interesting note, but let's also the latter part of the statement ... 'Right now, most of my machines seem to have Fedora 7 on then, but that's only a statement of fact, not meant to be that I think it's necessarily "better" than the other distros.' In other words, we do _not_ want to use this in _any_ marketing sense. -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From efeldhusen.lists at gmail.com Thu Jul 19 16:04:29 2007 From: efeldhusen.lists at gmail.com (Eric J. Feldhusen) Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 12:04:29 -0400 Subject: Linus Torvalds: Fedora User In-Reply-To: <1184855490.3267.10.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> References: <3668180e0707190704m3b6fda42q4f4a3622bcfdb789@mail.gmail.com> <1184855490.3267.10.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Message-ID: <469F8B8D.7080107@gmail.com> Bryan J. Smith wrote: > Interesting note, but let's also the latter part of the statement ... > > > 'Right now, most of my machines seem to have Fedora 7 on then, but > that's only a statement of fact, not meant to be that I think it's > necessarily "better" than the other distros.' > > In other words, we do _not_ want to use this in _any_ marketing > sense. On the plus side, his statement of > I'll take the nice ones with simple installers etc, because to me, > that's the whole and only point of using a distribution in the first > place. is a positive statement regarding the installation process of Fedora. Still couldn't be used for marketing, but it's a nice compliment. -- Eric Feldhusen Network Administrator http://www.remc1.org eric at remc1.org PO Box 270 (906) 482-4520 x239 809 Hecla St (906) 482-5031 fax Hancock, MI 49930 (906) 370 6202 mobile From jan at fedoraproject.org Thu Jul 19 18:40:31 2007 From: jan at fedoraproject.org (jan birsa) Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 20:40:31 +0200 Subject: Linus Torvalds: Fedora User In-Reply-To: <469F8B8D.7080107@gmail.com> References: <3668180e0707190704m3b6fda42q4f4a3622bcfdb789@mail.gmail.com> <1184855490.3267.10.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <469F8B8D.7080107@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1833f76a0707191140v628d9179hc42d8026bf1a102e@mail.gmail.com> Sweet, can't say other On 7/19/07, Eric J. Feldhusen wrote: > > Bryan J. Smith wrote: > > Interesting note, but let's also the latter part of the statement ... > > > > > > 'Right now, most of my machines seem to have Fedora 7 on then, but > > that's only a statement of fact, not meant to be that I think it's > > necessarily "better" than the other distros.' > > > > In other words, we do _not_ want to use this in _any_ marketing > > sense. > > On the plus side, his statement of > > > I'll take the nice ones with simple installers etc, because to me, > > that's the whole and only point of using a distribution in the first > > place. > > is a positive statement regarding the installation process of Fedora. > Still couldn't be used for marketing, but it's a nice compliment. > > -- > Eric Feldhusen > Network Administrator http://www.remc1.org > eric at remc1.org > PO Box 270 (906) 482-4520 x239 > 809 Hecla St (906) 482-5031 fax > Hancock, MI 49930 (906) 370 6202 mobile > > -- > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list > -- jan at fedoraproject.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From b.j.smith at ieee.org Thu Jul 19 19:42:38 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 15:42:38 -0400 Subject: Linus Torvalds: Fedora User In-Reply-To: <469F8B8D.7080107@gmail.com> References: <3668180e0707190704m3b6fda42q4f4a3622bcfdb789@mail.gmail.com> <1184855490.3267.10.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <469F8B8D.7080107@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1184874158.6517.2.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> On Thu, 2007-07-19 at 12:04 -0400, Eric J. Feldhusen wrote: > On the plus side, his statement of > ... > is a positive statement regarding the installation process of Fedora. > Still couldn't be used for marketing, but it's a nice compliment. Agreed. Although I still cringe when it comes to distros being based on installers, instead of actual usage. At the same time, people who just have something against distros are always going to find something to fault. In general, I think the balance Fedora strikes, and continues to strike, is all that matters. It's not going to satisfy all, but it certainly does a lot for many. With all the fanfare Ubuntu gets with end-consumers, Fedora still gets a lot of the installed based that matters to me. IT Professionals who can bring in a DVD and install it on countless corporate networked systems without either any legal or technical roadblocks. And, again, that's all that matters to me, among countless other IT Professionals. -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From fab at fedoraproject.org Thu Jul 19 20:13:19 2007 From: fab at fedoraproject.org (Fabian Affolter) Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 22:13:19 +0200 Subject: Fedora Logo Message-ID: <469FC5DF.1030008@fedoraproject.org> Hi all, On Monday I've sent a request for the Fedora Logo because the organization team of a event in Switzerland needs SVG for printing their booklets. Is this address logo at fedoraproject.org still valid? Regards, Fabian From jmbabich at gmail.com Thu Jul 19 20:50:39 2007 From: jmbabich at gmail.com (John Babich) Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 23:50:39 +0300 Subject: Volunteers needed for GITEX (8-12 September) Message-ID: <9d2c731f0707191350n7294f99ex9f336ddff3c266f1@mail.gmail.com> Fedora Ambassadors and Fedorans everywhere: I am doing my best to get a Fedora presence in the Red Hat EMEA booth at GITEX, being held this year on 8-12 September. See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GITEX for details. There is now less than 2 months to GITEX and the clock is ticking... There has been some interest shown by Red Hat EMEA in letting us share their booth. I will be following up in the next few days. This is being held in Dubai, UAE. I am assuming there will be some Fedorans among the over 100,000 expected visitors. (If there aren't, we're in big trouble ). I can use all the help I can get to man the booth, answer questions, produce and distribute live CDs, etc. If you are attending GITEX this year and can spare some time to help out, I think it will be a productive and fun time for all involved. Please sign up at the above link if you have wiki access. If not, contact me any which way you can. John Babich Volunteer, Fedora Project From tchung at fedoraproject.org Thu Jul 19 21:33:02 2007 From: tchung at fedoraproject.org (Thomas Chung) Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 14:33:02 -0700 Subject: Fedora Logo In-Reply-To: <469FC5DF.1030008@fedoraproject.org> References: <469FC5DF.1030008@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <369bce3b0707191433w5cfb7b18je02a6e8ba2deebc@mail.gmail.com> On 7/19/07, Fabian Affolter wrote: > Hi all, > > On Monday I've sent a request for the Fedora Logo because the > organization team of a event in Switzerland needs SVG for printing their > booklets. > > Is this address logo at fedoraproject.org still valid? > > Regards, > > Fabian Well, it's currently pointing to OTRS which is going away. Mike, do you have a suggestion? Regards, -- Thomas Chung http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasChung From gotencoolwebmaster at yahoo.es Fri Jul 20 02:32:38 2007 From: gotencoolwebmaster at yahoo.es (Eduardo =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Villagr=E1n?= Morales) Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 22:32:38 -0400 Subject: Fedora Logo In-Reply-To: <369bce3b0707191433w5cfb7b18je02a6e8ba2deebc@mail.gmail.com> References: <469FC5DF.1030008@fedoraproject.org> <369bce3b0707191433w5cfb7b18je02a6e8ba2deebc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1184898758.2526.1.camel@trauco> El jue, 19-07-2007 a las 14:33 -0700, Thomas Chung escribi?: > On 7/19/07, Fabian Affolter wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > On Monday I've sent a request for the Fedora Logo because the > > organization team of a event in Switzerland needs SVG for printing their > > booklets. > > > > Is this address logo at fedoraproject.org still valid? I request this material 3 months ago, have this material and can send it to you. > > > > Regards, > > > > Fabian > > Well, it's currently pointing to OTRS which is going away. > Mike, do you have a suggestion? > Regards, > -- > Thomas Chung > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasChung > -- Eduardo Villagr?n Morales Embajador Fedora Linuxdiinf -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Esta parte del mensaje est? firmada digitalmente URL: From nicu_fedora at nicubunu.ro Fri Jul 20 05:39:20 2007 From: nicu_fedora at nicubunu.ro (Nicu Buculei) Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 08:39:20 +0300 Subject: Fedora Logo In-Reply-To: <1184898758.2526.1.camel@trauco> References: <469FC5DF.1030008@fedoraproject.org> <369bce3b0707191433w5cfb7b18je02a6e8ba2deebc@mail.gmail.com> <1184898758.2526.1.camel@trauco> Message-ID: <46A04A88.5090301@nicubunu.ro> Eduardo Villagr?n Morales wrote: > El jue, 19-07-2007 a las 14:33 -0700, Thomas Chung escribi?: >> On 7/19/07, Fabian Affolter wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> >>> On Monday I've sent a request for the Fedora Logo because the >>> organization team of a event in Switzerland needs SVG for printing their >>> booklets. >>> >>> Is this address logo at fedoraproject.org still valid? > I request this material 3 months ago, have this material and can send it > to you. Please don't do that, there are *a lot* of places from one can get the source of the logo if he want only the logo, the use of that address is preferred as you will get the blessing from a trademark point of view. >>> Fabian >> Well, it's currently pointing to OTRS which is going away. >> Mike, do you have a suggestion? I think at some point that address used to go to a live person (gdk and later Mo). -- nicu :: http://nicubunu.ro :: http://nicubunu.blogspot.com Cool Fedora wallpapers: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro/wallpapers/ Open Clip Art Library: http://www.openclipart.org my Fedora stuff: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro From marklf777 at gmail.com Sat Jul 21 14:28:17 2007 From: marklf777 at gmail.com (Mark F. Liu) Date: Sat, 21 Jul 2007 22:28:17 +0800 Subject: an very brief introduction of me Message-ID: <46A21801.4090403@gmail.com> Hi all, My name is Mark F. Liu. I am from China and would like to join the Fedora Marketing project. The guy, whose Fedora project name is bbbush, introduced me to come. Thanks. Mark F. Liu From marklf777 at gmail.com Sat Jul 21 16:03:54 2007 From: marklf777 at gmail.com (Mark F. Liu) Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2007 00:03:54 +0800 Subject: Who can help? Message-ID: <46A22E6A.306@gmail.com> Hi all, I have requested membership in the marketing group, but this membership needs be approved. That would be grateful, if some people can help me. BTW, could someone tell me what would be the top mission of marketing group? Thanks. Mark F. Liu From neugens at limasoftware.net Sun Jul 22 11:22:17 2007 From: neugens at limasoftware.net (Mario Torre) Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2007 13:22:17 +0200 Subject: Who can help? In-Reply-To: <46A22E6A.306@gmail.com> References: <46A22E6A.306@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1185103337.3296.3.camel@nirvana.limasoftware.net> Il giorno dom, 22/07/2007 alle 00.03 +0800, Mark F. Liu ha scritto: > Hi all, > > I have requested membership in the marketing group, but this membership > needs be approved. > > That would be grateful, if some people can help me. > > BTW, could someone tell me what would be the top mission of marketing group? > > Thanks. > > Mark F. Liu Hi! Welcome! This is a page that can give you some good starting point: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Join#PeoplePerson Mario -- Lima Software - http://www.limasoftware.net/ GNU Classpath Developer - http://www.classpath.org/ Fedora Ambassador - http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MarioTorre Jabber: neugens at jabber.org pgp key: http://subkeys.pgp.net/ PGP Key ID: 80F240CF Fingerprint: BA39 9666 94EC 8B73 27FA FC7C 4086 63E3 80F2 40CF Please, support open standards: http://opendocumentfellowship.org/petition/ http://www.nosoftwarepatents.com/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Questa ? una parte del messaggio firmata digitalmente URL: From marklf777 at gmail.com Sun Jul 22 13:38:49 2007 From: marklf777 at gmail.com (Mark F. Liu) Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2007 21:38:49 +0800 Subject: Who can help? In-Reply-To: <1185103337.3296.3.camel@nirvana.limasoftware.net> References: <46A22E6A.306@gmail.com> <1185103337.3296.3.camel@nirvana.limasoftware.net> Message-ID: <46A35DE9.5040005@gmail.com> Mario Torre ??: > Il giorno dom, 22/07/2007 alle 00.03 +0800, Mark F. Liu ha scritto: > >> Hi all, >> >> I have requested membership in the marketing group, but this membership >> needs be approved. >> >> That would be grateful, if some people can help me. >> >> BTW, could someone tell me what would be the top mission of marketing group? >> >> Thanks. >> >> Mark F. Liu >> > > Hi! Welcome! > > This is a page that can give you some good starting point: > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Join#PeoplePerson > > Mario > Hi Mario, Thanks for you reply! I have also applied the membership of ambassador, could please tell me what should I do for me to be approved? Both of my Status of marketing and ambassador are unapproved by now:( Thanks. Marklf From tchung at fedoraproject.org Sun Jul 22 18:35:59 2007 From: tchung at fedoraproject.org (Thomas Chung) Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2007 11:35:59 -0700 Subject: Who can help? In-Reply-To: <46A35DE9.5040005@gmail.com> References: <46A22E6A.306@gmail.com> <1185103337.3296.3.camel@nirvana.limasoftware.net> <46A35DE9.5040005@gmail.com> Message-ID: <369bce3b0707221135h7a1b4667ib9e42edcc121fc8c@mail.gmail.com> On 7/22/07, Mark F. Liu wrote: > Thanks for you reply! I have also applied the membership of ambassador, > could please tell me what should I do for me to be approved? > > Both of my Status of marketing and ambassador are unapproved by now:( > > > Thanks. > > > Marklf One of Fedora Project contributors will contact you soon. Regards, -- Thomas Chung http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasChung From mr.gopal.das at gmail.com Mon Jul 23 03:34:21 2007 From: mr.gopal.das at gmail.com (gopal das) Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2007 09:04:21 +0530 Subject: an very brief introduction of me In-Reply-To: <46A21801.4090403@gmail.com> References: <46A21801.4090403@gmail.com> Message-ID: <6f631c430707222034g18cdbf18mcfac1612bc769d31@mail.gmail.com> HI Mark F. Liu Welcome to Fedora project and enjoy to be a part of the world of freedom. On 7/21/07, Mark F. Liu wrote: > > Hi all, > > My name is Mark F. Liu. I am from China and would like to join the > Fedora Marketing project. > > The guy, whose Fedora project name is bbbush, introduced me to come. > > Thanks. > > Mark F. Liu > > -- > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mr.gopal.das at gmail.com Mon Jul 23 03:35:27 2007 From: mr.gopal.das at gmail.com (gopal das) Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2007 09:05:27 +0530 Subject: an very brief introduction of me In-Reply-To: <6f631c430707222034g18cdbf18mcfac1612bc769d31@mail.gmail.com> References: <46A21801.4090403@gmail.com> <6f631c430707222034g18cdbf18mcfac1612bc769d31@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6f631c430707222035w78a2abd6l63fe9128d8b4458f@mail.gmail.com> On 7/23/07, gopal das wrote: > > HI Mark F. Liu > Welcome to Fedora project and enjoy to be a part of the world of freedom. > cheers > Gopal Das > On 7/21/07, Mark F. Liu < marklf777 at gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > > > My name is Mark F. Liu. I am from China and would like to join the > > Fedora Marketing project. > > > > The guy, whose Fedora project name is bbbush, introduced me to come. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Mark F. Liu > > > > -- > > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From b.j.smith at ieee.org Mon Jul 23 03:49:00 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2007 23:49:00 -0400 Subject: Post-introduction (some 2 years late) ... Message-ID: <1185162540.9917.33.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> I've been on the list some 2 years, and I've never introduced myself. It's not really that I want to introduce myself now, but rather make some statements/clarifications that those running this list should be aware of. First off, I joined in 2005 August following interest in the logo. I raised some legal considerations that the time (which caused some negative interest) and I pretty much been a lurker "on and off" since. Secondly off, I never put forth the effort to become a "Fedora Ambassador" myself, of which I hope does not disqualify myself from being on this list. I have pitched the same idea to other groups (e.g., LPI for their Alumni) because I think it's a good avenue. Third, I joined a Linux vendor this past week, so I don't think I can be an impartial Fedora Ambassador in the future, at least not while I'm at this company. Again, following the second point, let me know if this disqualifies myself from being on this list. I won't talk about my history except as stated in my signature ... "Professional, Technical Annoyance." That and the disclaimer that I've made 90% of my salary/billables on Red Hat solutions over the last 12 years. I.e., I'm your typical, American Libertarian capitalist pig who probably wouldn't be here if it didn't make me so rich. ;) -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From jeremy at linuxwiz.net Mon Jul 23 04:04:21 2007 From: jeremy at linuxwiz.net (Jeremy L. Gaddis) Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2007 00:04:21 -0400 Subject: Post-introduction (some 2 years late) ... In-Reply-To: <1185162540.9917.33.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> References: <1185162540.9917.33.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Message-ID: <536fdec90707222104g77cc5bf1mfae61c630b86195@mail.gmail.com> On 7/22/07, Bryan J. Smith wrote: > > I won't talk about my history except as stated in my signature ... > "Professional, Technical Annoyance." That and the disclaimer that I've > made 90% of my salary/billables on Red Hat solutions over the last 12 > years. I.e., I'm your typical, American Libertarian capitalist pig who > probably wouldn't be here if it didn't make me so rich. ;) > At least you're honest. Myself, I do it for the chicks. =) -- Jeremy L. Gaddis http://www.jeremygaddis.com/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kwade at redhat.com Mon Jul 23 04:43:41 2007 From: kwade at redhat.com (Karsten Wade) Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2007 21:43:41 -0700 Subject: Post-introduction (some 2 years late) ... In-Reply-To: <1185162540.9917.33.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> References: <1185162540.9917.33.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Message-ID: <1185165821.17380.340.camel@erato.phig.org> On Sun, 2007-07-22 at 23:49 -0400, Bryan J. Smith wrote: > I've been on the list some 2 years, and I've never introduced myself. > It's not really that I want to introduce myself now, but rather make > some statements/clarifications that those running this list should be > aware of. Welcome, Bryan. ;-D > First off, I joined in 2005 August following interest in the logo. I > raised some legal considerations that the time (which caused some > negative interest) and I pretty much been a lurker "on and off" since. FWIW, I usually appreciate your viewpoint. At the least, I'm impressed with how much you can type (and remember from the top of your head) on a Blackberry > Secondly off, I never put forth the effort to become a "Fedora > Ambassador" myself, of which I hope does not disqualify myself from > being on this list. I have pitched the same idea to other groups (e.g., > LPI for their Alumni) because I think it's a good avenue. This is a general list about growing Fedora, what is usually called 'marketing' in a business. IMHO, all are welcome, except haters. You don't strike me as a hater. > Third, I joined a Linux vendor this past week, so I don't think I can be > an impartial Fedora Ambassador in the future, at least not while I'm at > this company. Again, following the second point, let me know if this > disqualifies myself from being on this list. Naturally, I'm curious who that is, and note you explicitly don't say (here or on your blog), so I'll respect your privacy and not ask. Regardless, Fedora is the upstream for *a lot* of downstream, as well as a cross stream with all other projects. Again, all are welcome save haters ... > I won't talk about my history except as stated in my signature ... > "Professional, Technical Annoyance." That and the disclaimer that I've > made 90% of my salary/billables on Red Hat solutions over the last 12 > years. I.e., I'm your typical, American Libertarian capitalist pig who > probably wouldn't be here if it didn't make me so rich. ;) http://www.google.com/search?q=%22bryan+J+smith%22+fedora-marketing-list I'm actually surprised it got so few hits ... - Karsten -- Karsten Wade, 108 Editor ^ Fedora Documentation Project Sr. Developer Relations Mgr. | fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject quaid.108.redhat.com | gpg key: AD0E0C41 ////////////////////////////////// \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From hudsonman35 at gmail.com Tue Jul 24 21:34:09 2007 From: hudsonman35 at gmail.com (Markus McLaughlin) Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2007 17:34:09 -0400 Subject: linuxglobe's mission and Fedora Message-ID: Hello fellow Fedorians AND fellow Linux Users/Developers! My name is Mark McLaughlin, I have loved Fedora since Core 5 and can not WAIT to try out 8! I am a writer and a "super user" who dabbles in Fedora, MAC OS X, and once used the dreaded Windoze XP. I been a fan of the UK's Linux Format magazine for over a year now and I have not seen ANY American counterpart so I started linuxglobe.net / linuxglobe.wordpress.com, a pdf-based e-magazine slash linux torrent portal to convert frustrated Windoze Users and regular folks into Linux Users and Developers! I want to spread the word about this very ambitious project and I chose Fedora as linuxglobe's MAIN OS, I see its potential as it gets better AND better. What I ultimately want to do is to have a national North American magazine with a free DVD attached, published with Fedora 9 that has themes made for it by linuxglobe subscribers and/or fans using GIMP, GIMPshop, or Inkscape. I am sick and tired of seeing the hideous Steve Ballmer at Microsoft grinning every time Vista makes a profit! It is time to show regular folks that Linux is here for THEM too and we will make it easier for them to use on any computer they have! What Fedora should have is how-to documents/videos in a "folder" on everything like setting a wireless network, installing a printer, finding photos/music/videos, etc. Fedora 8 and beyond must have optional features that are good equivalents to itunes, iphoto, imovie, the Vista sidebar, the MAC "bar," a news ticker, improvements to the upcoming "codec buddy," an updated Skype interface, voice recognition, better text to speech software for the blind, improvements to ogg theora, and a combined KDE/GNOME interface. These are just many improvements I like to see in Fedora in the months to come. Fedora can help linuxglobe by finding one person willing to test every release out and have a review of it ready a few weeks after the initial debut. It is very important that Fedora keeps improving and always putting in features a User would want to have through free software. Please consider what I propose, I would like to spread the word about Fedora in Boston where there are SO many college students and regular folks who want to use a computer but don't know what's out there. What can be done out here to have Fedora mentioned and distributed? Should I invest a small amount to spread the word about Fedora in the Boston Globe? All we need is the web site name and a catchy phrase! Any ideas about that? Should I go out to some major event around here and give out free Fedora DVDs? Mark McLaughlin - Editor-In-Chief, linuxglobe.wordpress.com - Fedora User / Writer -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jmbabich at gmail.com Fri Jul 27 13:20:45 2007 From: jmbabich at gmail.com (John Babich) Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2007 16:20:45 +0300 Subject: Fedora at GITEX 2007 (42 Days to Go) Message-ID: <9d2c731f0707270620rd63cca1ic46d3d3269a5398e@mail.gmail.com> There are 42 days left before GITEX in Dubai, United Arab Emirates. Here is a quick update: Red Hat is being very supportive. They are providing the Fedora Project with a dedicated demo pod. One urgent task is to submit the design for the large demo pod sign. The Fedora Project will have the opportunity to show Fedora 7 in action booting on a laptop, from a live CD and from a USB stick. We hope to give out a few hundred Fedora live CDS and explain how to spin custom versions with Revisor. Since this is a commercial exhibition, we will be explaining open source concepts to members of the business community, and dispelling myths surrounding free and open source software. We also will assist in demonstrating the OLPC XO laptop. This is a great opportunity to expose government representatives from Africa, the Middle East and Asia to the One Laptop Per Child Project. What we desperately need is people willing to commit a few hours to man the booth, answer questions, do demos and show the Fedora Project at its finest. Please contact me any which way you can if you are interested. See the Fedora at GITEX wiki page (http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GITEX) for more details. John Babich Volunteer. Fedora Project From jmbabich at gmail.com Fri Jul 27 15:55:32 2007 From: jmbabich at gmail.com (John Babich) Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2007 18:55:32 +0300 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod Message-ID: <9d2c731f0707270855n77724008ie242297f28598377@mail.gmail.com> I need immediate feedback for the GITEX Demo Pod sign which Red Hat is generously providing. See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign for the example provided by Red Hat. Here is my attempt: The Fedora Project A Collection of Projects Sponsored by Red Hat and Developed as a Partnership between the Open Source Community and Red Hat Engineers * Produces Fedora 7, a Leading-edge Linux Distribution with a Graphical Installer, Advanced Desktop, Security and Administration Tools. * Provides Base Software for Red Hat Enterprise Linux and One Laptop Per Child. * Hosts the Fedora Localization Project, for Translating and Adapting Applications, Documentation and Websites to Specific Languages, Regions and Cultures * Develops Revisor, a Free Tool for Producing Custom Live CDs and USB Sticks. http://fedoraproject.org Best Regards, John Babich Volunteer, Fedora Project From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Fri Jul 27 20:34:14 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2007 02:04:14 +0530 Subject: Fedora stats offer insight into Linux usage Message-ID: <46AA56C6.2030201@fedoraproject.org> Hi, http://www.linux.com/feature/118197 Joe 'Zonker' Brockmeier talks with Fedora's Max Spevack about some recently released statistics. "The Fedora Project offered a peek under its kimono recently with details about Fedora 7 adoption and other statistics. Fedora 7 has snagged more than 300,000 users since its release at the end of May. While that sounds pretty good, Fedora Core 6 managed to attract more than 400,000 in roughly the same amount of time after its release. We asked Max Spevack, the Fedora project leader, whether the numbers are telling the full story." Rahul From gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx Fri Jul 27 22:05:35 2007 From: gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx (Gian Paolo Mureddu) Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2007 17:05:35 -0500 Subject: Fedora stats offer insight into Linux usage In-Reply-To: <46AA56C6.2030201@fedoraproject.org> References: <46AA56C6.2030201@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <46AA6C2F.40305@prodigy.net.mx> Rahul Sundaram escribi?: > Hi, > > > http://www.linux.com/feature/118197 > > Joe 'Zonker' Brockmeier talks with Fedora's Max Spevack about some > recently released statistics. "The Fedora Project offered a peek under > its kimono recently with details about Fedora 7 adoption and other > statistics. Fedora 7 has snagged more than 300,000 users since its > release at the end of May. While that sounds pretty good, Fedora Core > 6 managed to attract more than 400,000 in roughly the same amount of > time after its release. We asked Max Spevack, the Fedora project > leader, whether the numbers are telling the full story." > > Rahul > Excellent! This shows one more time the Fedora's leadership at taking initiative to not only have an Open Source Software distribution, but also Open Source Information. I wonder a couple of things, though: * Will RHEL include such methods to also measure system use? Or is there no need for this as it is "subscription based"? * How are the efforts to convince other distributions to also add to the smolt and others statistics efforts initiated by Fedora? * Do we envision a "global" statistics center where developers, hardware vendors, software vendors, distributors could look at in a future and better target their: * Products. * Development efforts. * Bug tracking systems. * Expected user base for a given product or service. This really looks very nice! Go, go Fedora! From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sat Jul 28 07:37:56 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2007 13:07:56 +0530 Subject: Fedora stats offer insight into Linux usage In-Reply-To: <46AA6C2F.40305@prodigy.net.mx> References: <46AA56C6.2030201@fedoraproject.org> <46AA6C2F.40305@prodigy.net.mx> Message-ID: <46AAF254.7000209@fedoraproject.org> Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: > Rahul Sundaram escribi?: >> Hi, >> >> >> http://www.linux.com/feature/118197 >> >> Joe 'Zonker' Brockmeier talks with Fedora's Max Spevack about some >> recently released statistics. "The Fedora Project offered a peek under >> its kimono recently with details about Fedora 7 adoption and other >> statistics. Fedora 7 has snagged more than 300,000 users since its >> release at the end of May. While that sounds pretty good, Fedora Core >> 6 managed to attract more than 400,000 in roughly the same amount of >> time after its release. We asked Max Spevack, the Fedora project >> leader, whether the numbers are telling the full story." >> >> Rahul >> > Excellent! This shows one more time the Fedora's leadership at taking > initiative to not only have an Open Source Software distribution, but > also Open Source Information. I wonder a couple of things, though: > > * Will RHEL include such methods to also measure system use? Or is there > no need for this as it is "subscription based"? There is a need for it but that need is fulfilled by registrations in RHN. Smolt is in fact derived from RHN client side tools and like Smolt RHEL has detailed statistics with more data by the virtue of being customers. > * How are the efforts to convince other distributions to also add to the > smolt and others statistics efforts initiated by Fedora? I am in discussions with Mandriva and SUSE. > * Do we envision a "global" statistics center where developers, hardware > vendors, software vendors, distributors could look at in a future and > better target their: > * Products. > * Development efforts. > * Bug tracking systems. > * Expected user base for a given product or service. > > This really looks very nice! Go, go Fedora! > Yes. If other distributions agree to adopt Smolt, the potential benefits are much larger. See http://rahulsundaram.livejournal.com/11995.html for more details. Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sat Jul 28 12:58:52 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2007 18:28:52 +0530 Subject: [Ambassadors] Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <9d2c731f0707270855n77724008ie242297f28598377@mail.gmail.com> References: <9d2c731f0707270855n77724008ie242297f28598377@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <46AB3D8C.9080704@fedoraproject.org> John Babich wrote: > I need immediate feedback for the GITEX Demo Pod sign which Red Hat is > generously providing. > > See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign for > the example provided by Red Hat. > > Here is my attempt: > > > > drop a mail to logo at fp.o for the request grant. > > The Fedora Project > > A Collection of Projects Sponsored by Red Hat and Developed as a > Partnership between the Open Source Community and Red Hat Engineers > > * Produces Fedora 7, a Leading-edge Linux Distribution with a > Graphical Installer, Advanced Desktop, Security and Administration > Tools. ... > .. that is always Freely and legally available for any use, commercial or otherwise with source code giving you complete freedom to make any custom modifications necessary for your organization. Around 8000 software packages available for desktop, workstation or server needs. > * Provides Base Software for Red Hat Enterprise Linux and One Laptop Per Child. > > * Hosts the Fedora Localization Project, for Translating and Adapting > Applications, Documentation and Websites to Specific Languages, > Regions and Cultures > > * Develops Revisor, a Free Tool for Producing Custom Live CDs and USB Sticks, ... Custom regular images and can be used to create software appliances easily in a graphical click through process. Rahul From jmbabich at gmail.com Sat Jul 28 17:13:33 2007 From: jmbabich at gmail.com (John Babich) Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2007 20:13:33 +0300 Subject: [Ambassadors] Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <46AB3D8C.9080704@fedoraproject.org> References: <9d2c731f0707270855n77724008ie242297f28598377@mail.gmail.com> <46AB3D8C.9080704@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <9d2c731f0707281013wb48a31egdf308701efe482d6@mail.gmail.com> On 7/28/07, Rahul Sundaram wrote: < snip > > drop a mail to logo at fp.o for the request grant. > Will do... > > Thanks, Rahul and Thomas, for your input. I think this will the final version: The Fedora Project A Collection of Projects Sponsored by Red Hat and Developed as a Partnership between the Open Source Community and Red Hat Engineers * Produces Fedora 7, a Leading-edge Linux Distribution with Advanced Desktop, Security and Administration Tools, Freely Available with Source Code, Giving Complete Freedom to Make Custom Versions * Provides Base Software for Red Hat Enterprise Linux and One Laptop Per Child * Develops Revisor, a Free Graphical Tool for Producing Custom Live CDs, USB Sticks, Custom Images and Software Appliances * Hosts the Fedora Localization Project, for Translating and Adapting Applications, Documentation and Websites to Specific Languages, Regions and Cultures http://fedoraproject.org Best Regards, John Babich Volunteer, Fedora Projject From jmbabich at gmail.com Sat Jul 28 19:24:13 2007 From: jmbabich at gmail.com (John Babich) Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2007 22:24:13 +0300 Subject: [Ambassadors] Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <9d2c731f0707281013wb48a31egdf308701efe482d6@mail.gmail.com> References: <9d2c731f0707270855n77724008ie242297f28598377@mail.gmail.com> <46AB3D8C.9080704@fedoraproject.org> <9d2c731f0707281013wb48a31egdf308701efe482d6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9d2c731f0707281224g23a8e99dmf4e79cdd55390dbb@mail.gmail.com> I felt creative today, so I made a mockup of the GITEX 2007 Fedora Project Sign: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign If there are no objections, I will submit this to Red Hat Europe on Monday. Best Regards, John Babich Volunteer, Fedora Project From jmbabich at gmail.com Sat Jul 28 19:36:39 2007 From: jmbabich at gmail.com (John Babich) Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2007 22:36:39 +0300 Subject: Request to Use Fedora Logo for GITEX 2007 Message-ID: <9d2c731f0707281236j426c4e54oe52000f565f58a16@mail.gmail.com> To Whom It May Concern: I am putting together a Fedora presence for GITEX 2007. Red Hat Europe is providing the Fedora Project with a dedicated demo pod, complete with large sign. See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GITEX for a description of the Fedora event. See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign for a mockup of the sign. Note that the color scheme and the design of the banner is based on an example provided by Red Hat. Red Hat will produce the sign for the demo pod. Best Regards, John Babich Volunteer, Fedora Project From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sat Jul 28 19:46:26 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 01:16:26 +0530 Subject: A computer in every pot Message-ID: <46AB9D12.1060800@fedoraproject.org> Hi The user interface is called Sugar and not the OS itself but a good article nevertheless. BBC published a couple of articles with more technical information and videos featuring Christopher Blizzard, lead OLPC team in Red Hat. http://www.economist.com/science/displaystory.cfm?story_id=9539441 "If the ingenuity of the XO?s hardware is impressive, the machine?s software is truly ground-breaking. Red Hat, the world?s largest Linux distributor, has provided an extremely compact version of its Fedora operating system, called Sugar, that uses a mere 130 megabytes of the XO?s flash memory. By comparison, Windows XP requires 1.65 gigabytes." http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/6908946.stm http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/6679431.stm Rahul From jmbabich at gmail.com Sat Jul 28 20:09:47 2007 From: jmbabich at gmail.com (John Babich) Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2007 23:09:47 +0300 Subject: A computer in every pot In-Reply-To: <46AB9D12.1060800@fedoraproject.org> References: <46AB9D12.1060800@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <9d2c731f0707281309s38656754j33e6691d4109ccad@mail.gmail.com> On 7/28/07, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Hi > > The user interface is called Sugar and not the OS itself but a good > article nevertheless. BBC published a couple of articles with more > technical information and videos featuring Christopher Blizzard, lead > OLPC team in Red Hat. > > http://www.economist.com/science/displaystory.cfm?story_id=9539441 > Excellent articles, Rahul. Just to be picky, the above link is from The Economist, the highly-respected British business magazine. To its credit, the Economist magazine does explicitly mention Fedora. The BBC articles are quite good in their details and illustrations, including the Flash video clip of Chris Blizzard. All in all, great publicity for the OLPC and Fedora, although Fedora is referenced by a strangely obscure phrase in the BBC article: "The laptop has a bespoke Linux operating system (OS) developed by leading open source software company Red Hat." Perhaps, the OLPC XO laptop will feature in an episode of BBC World's Click TV show in the near future. Let's hope they mention Fedora in the show. Best Regards, John Babich Volunteer, Fedora Project From hisham.imam at gmail.com Sat Jul 28 21:46:08 2007 From: hisham.imam at gmail.com (Hisham Abdel-Magid) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 00:46:08 +0300 Subject: [Ambassadors] Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <9d2c731f0707281224g23a8e99dmf4e79cdd55390dbb@mail.gmail.com> References: <9d2c731f0707270855n77724008ie242297f28598377@mail.gmail.com> <46AB3D8C.9080704@fedoraproject.org> <9d2c731f0707281013wb48a31egdf308701efe482d6@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707281224g23a8e99dmf4e79cdd55390dbb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <59e007ed0707281446k4437b66wcd48dff3a9702afe@mail.gmail.com> hi all... i feel terrible for not being able to connect online during this day.. dear John, sorry for the late notice (i think i missed a lot of discussion).... anyway, i made a small extra work on the background (unfortunately with the un-updated points).. Nevertheless, i wish to know what do you think about it (all of u Fedoras).. it could be a flayer too (not sticking to be a background only)... what do u think? waiting for your opinion to update it or forget about it ^_^ thanx oops, i forgot... it's on: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign : ) hisham abdel-magid On 7/28/07, John Babich wrote: > > I felt creative today, so I made a mockup of the GITEX 2007 Fedora > Project Sign: > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign > > If there are no objections, I will submit this to Red Hat Europe > on Monday. > > Best Regards, > > John Babich > Volunteer, Fedora Project > > -- > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx Sat Jul 28 22:01:47 2007 From: gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx (Gian Paolo Mureddu) Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2007 17:01:47 -0500 Subject: A computer in every pot In-Reply-To: <46AB9D12.1060800@fedoraproject.org> References: <46AB9D12.1060800@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <46ABBCCB.7030901@prodigy.net.mx> Rahul Sundaram escribi?: > Hi > > The user interface is called Sugar and not the OS itself but a good > article nevertheless. BBC published a couple of articles with more > technical information and videos featuring Christopher Blizzard, lead > OLPC team in Red Hat. > > http://www.economist.com/science/displaystory.cfm?story_id=9539441 > > "If the ingenuity of the XO?s hardware is impressive, the machine?s > software is truly ground-breaking. Red Hat, the world?s largest Linux > distributor, has provided an extremely compact version of its Fedora > operating system, called Sugar, that uses a mere 130 megabytes of the > XO?s flash memory. By comparison, Windows XP requires 1.65 gigabytes." > > > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/6908946.stm > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/6679431.stm > > Rahul > Thanks for sharing, I hadn't had the opportunity to watching the Sugar UI in action in the OLPC. However, I still don't like it that the BBC uses codecs that make it difficult for users of 64-bit systems to watch (not all plugins available are capable of displaying Windows Media video the way they send it, and there is no Real Player plugin for 64-bit systems). Still the Flash videos I could watch, and loved them. From jmbabich at gmail.com Sat Jul 28 22:05:20 2007 From: jmbabich at gmail.com (John Babich) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 01:05:20 +0300 Subject: [Ambassadors] Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <59e007ed0707281446k4437b66wcd48dff3a9702afe@mail.gmail.com> References: <9d2c731f0707270855n77724008ie242297f28598377@mail.gmail.com> <46AB3D8C.9080704@fedoraproject.org> <9d2c731f0707281013wb48a31egdf308701efe482d6@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707281224g23a8e99dmf4e79cdd55390dbb@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281446k4437b66wcd48dff3a9702afe@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9d2c731f0707281505h347e338bid70193321aabf643@mail.gmail.com> On 7/29/07, Hisham Abdel-Magid wrote: > hi all... > i feel terrible for not being able to connect online during this day.. > dear John, sorry for the late notice (i think i missed a lot of > discussion).... > > anyway, i made a small extra work on the background (unfortunately with the > un-updated points).. > Nevertheless, i wish to know what do you think about it (all of u Fedoras).. > it could be a flayer too (not sticking to be a background only)... what do u > think? Hisham: Thanks for taking the time to produce such an artistic piece of work. My very plain poster is based upon the example provided by Red Hat. I'm not sure we have to be so conservative in the layout or not. I will ask the person in charge of designing the demo pod if we can be a bit more daring. Regardless, we do need flyers, and I like your design a great deal. If nothing else, I would like to use your design for the flyer. I think one of the attractions of the Fedora Project is the opportunity for people to express their creativity. I'll let you know what the result is in a few days. Here's the other challenge: I would like our flyers to be in at least three languages: English, Arabic and French. Best Regards, John Babich Volunteer, Fedora Project From hisham.imam at gmail.com Sat Jul 28 22:28:00 2007 From: hisham.imam at gmail.com (Hisham Abdel-Magid) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 01:28:00 +0300 Subject: [Ambassadors] Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <9d2c731f0707281505h347e338bid70193321aabf643@mail.gmail.com> References: <9d2c731f0707270855n77724008ie242297f28598377@mail.gmail.com> <46AB3D8C.9080704@fedoraproject.org> <9d2c731f0707281013wb48a31egdf308701efe482d6@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707281224g23a8e99dmf4e79cdd55390dbb@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281446k4437b66wcd48dff3a9702afe@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707281505h347e338bid70193321aabf643@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <59e007ed0707281528w5cc91c2cq5acbd8a458631786@mail.gmail.com> John: I'm glad that you liked it.. now i'm synchronizing the design with the latest one.. I don't know French language, but I will be happy to translate to Arabic ... Hey Arabic ambassadors, support and opinion please (let us make it as good as it could be)... And you French ambassadors, send the translation to me... and the French version will be available ASAP On 7/29/07, John Babich wrote: > > On 7/29/07, Hisham Abdel-Magid wrote: > > hi all... > > i feel terrible for not being able to connect online during this day.. > > dear John, sorry for the late notice (i think i missed a lot of > > discussion).... > > > > anyway, i made a small extra work on the background (unfortunately with > the > > un-updated points).. > > Nevertheless, i wish to know what do you think about it (all of u > Fedoras).. > > it could be a flayer too (not sticking to be a background only)... what > do u > > think? > > Hisham: > > Thanks for taking the time to produce such an artistic piece of work. > > My very plain poster is based upon the example provided by Red Hat. > I'm not sure we have to be so conservative in the layout or not. I > will ask the person in charge of designing the demo pod if we can be a > bit more daring. > > Regardless, we do need flyers, and I like your design a great deal. If > nothing else, I would like to use your design for the flyer. I think > one of the attractions of the Fedora Project is the opportunity for > people to express their creativity. > > I'll let you know what the result is in a few days. > > Here's the other challenge: I would like our flyers to be in at least > three languages: English, Arabic and French. > > Best Regards, > > John Babich > Volunteer, Fedora Project > > -- > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list > -- Eng. Hisham Isam M. Abdel-Magid Head of Department in charge, Dept. of Shelter & Physical Development (DSPD) Institute for Technological Research (ITR) National Center for Research (NCR) Ministry of Science and Technology (MOST) P.O.Box 2404 Khartoum Sudan Mobile: +249 122 007 122 E.mail: hisham.imam at gmail.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hisham.imam at gmail.com Sat Jul 28 23:51:30 2007 From: hisham.imam at gmail.com (Hisham Abdel-Magid) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 02:51:30 +0300 Subject: [Ambassadors] Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <59e007ed0707281528w5cc91c2cq5acbd8a458631786@mail.gmail.com> References: <9d2c731f0707270855n77724008ie242297f28598377@mail.gmail.com> <46AB3D8C.9080704@fedoraproject.org> <9d2c731f0707281013wb48a31egdf308701efe482d6@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707281224g23a8e99dmf4e79cdd55390dbb@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281446k4437b66wcd48dff3a9702afe@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707281505h347e338bid70193321aabf643@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281528w5cc91c2cq5acbd8a458631786@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <59e007ed0707281651s6d8fe1aenf6aee2518555b76@mail.gmail.com> English version> status: updated : ) http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign (p.s.: resolution of image in website is reduced; i.e. when it comes to printing stage i will e.mail it directly) Arabic version> status: in progress : | French version> status: pending : ( On 7/29/07, Hisham Abdel-Magid wrote: > > John: > I'm glad that you liked it.. now i'm synchronizing the design with the > latest one.. > I don't know French language, but I will be happy to translate to Arabic > ... > Hey Arabic ambassadors, support and opinion please (let us make it as good > as it could be)... > And you French ambassadors, send the translation to me... and the French > version will be available ASAP > > > On 7/29/07, John Babich < jmbabich at gmail.com> wrote: > > > > On 7/29/07, Hisham Abdel-Magid < hisham.imam at gmail.com> wrote: > > > hi all... > > > i feel terrible for not being able to connect online during this day.. > > > dear John, sorry for the late notice (i think i missed a lot of > > > discussion).... > > > > > > anyway, i made a small extra work on the background (unfortunately > > with the > > > un-updated points).. > > > Nevertheless, i wish to know what do you think about it (all of u > > Fedoras).. > > > it could be a flayer too (not sticking to be a background only)... > > what do u > > > think? > > > > Hisham: > > > > Thanks for taking the time to produce such an artistic piece of work. > > > > My very plain poster is based upon the example provided by Red Hat. > > I'm not sure we have to be so conservative in the layout or not. I > > will ask the person in charge of designing the demo pod if we can be a > > bit more daring. > > > > Regardless, we do need flyers, and I like your design a great deal. If > > nothing else, I would like to use your design for the flyer. I think > > one of the attractions of the Fedora Project is the opportunity for > > people to express their creativity. > > > > I'll let you know what the result is in a few days. > > > > Here's the other challenge: I would like our flyers to be in at least > > three languages: English, Arabic and French. > > > > Best Regards, > > > > John Babich > > Volunteer, Fedora Project > > > > -- > > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list > > > > > > -- > Eng. Hisham Isam M. Abdel-Magid > Head of Department in charge, Dept. of Shelter & Physical Development > (DSPD) > Institute for Technological Research (ITR) > National Center for Research (NCR) > Ministry of Science and Technology (MOST) > P.O.Box 2404 > Khartoum > Sudan > Mobile: +249 122 007 122 > E.mail: hisham.imam at gmail.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jmbabich at gmail.com Sun Jul 29 05:38:01 2007 From: jmbabich at gmail.com (John Babich) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 08:38:01 +0300 Subject: [Ambassadors] Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <59e007ed0707281651s6d8fe1aenf6aee2518555b76@mail.gmail.com> References: <9d2c731f0707270855n77724008ie242297f28598377@mail.gmail.com> <46AB3D8C.9080704@fedoraproject.org> <9d2c731f0707281013wb48a31egdf308701efe482d6@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707281224g23a8e99dmf4e79cdd55390dbb@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281446k4437b66wcd48dff3a9702afe@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707281505h347e338bid70193321aabf643@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281528w5cc91c2cq5acbd8a458631786@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281651s6d8fe1aenf6aee2518555b76@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9d2c731f0707282238g4d7cc48bv81c44166ace2634@mail.gmail.com> On 7/29/07, Hisham Abdel-Magid wrote: > English version> status: updated : ) Wow, Hisham, thanks for rising to the challenge! I really appreciate it that you are taking the lead on this. Best Regards, John Babich Volunteer, Fedora Project From hisham.imam at gmail.com Sun Jul 29 09:46:15 2007 From: hisham.imam at gmail.com (Hisham Abdel-Magid) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 12:46:15 +0300 Subject: [Ambassadors] REMINDER French Meeting today 1830 #fedora-meeting In-Reply-To: <20070729105413.3cffc29b@agnetha.mrtomlinux> References: <20070729105413.3cffc29b@agnetha.mrtomlinux> Message-ID: <59e007ed0707290246u3a0b493sa6bc8c55ba94e705@mail.gmail.com> Dear Thomas: I suggest to put in your meeting agenda the translation of Fedora flyer at GITEX Dubai (Ref.: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign) Thanx HishamAbdelMagid On 7/29/07, Thomas Canniot wrote: > > This mail is a reminder for today?s meeting for French ambassadors and > _every_ interested people. > > 2007-07-29 / 18:30 UTC > > > IRC: freenode > #fedora-meeting > > > Ce mail est un rappel pour la r?union des ambassadeurs francophones, > qui aura lieu ce dimanche (29 juillet) ? 20h30 heure de Paris sur IRC > (freenode) #fedora-meeting . > > > Thomas Canniot > > -- > Fedora-ambassadors-list mailing list > Fedora-ambassadors-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From himam at fedoraproject.org Sun Jul 29 09:48:27 2007 From: himam at fedoraproject.org (Hisham Abdel-Magid) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 12:48:27 +0300 Subject: [Ambassadors] REMINDER French Meeting today 1830 #fedora-meeting In-Reply-To: <20070729105413.3cffc29b@agnetha.mrtomlinux> References: <20070729105413.3cffc29b@agnetha.mrtomlinux> Message-ID: <59e007ed0707290248uc3991e9r2494789b12a36e56@mail.gmail.com> Dear Thomas: I suggest to put in your meeting agenda the translation of Fedora flyer at GITEX Dubai (Ref.: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign ) Thanx HishamAbdelMagid Fedora Ambassador in Sudan On 7/29/07, Thomas Canniot wrote: > > This mail is a reminder for today?s meeting for French ambassadors and > _every_ interested people. > > 2007-07-29 / 18:30 UTC > > > IRC: freenode > #fedora-meeting > > > Ce mail est un rappel pour la r?union des ambassadeurs francophones, > qui aura lieu ce dimanche (29 juillet) ? 20h30 heure de Paris sur IRC > (freenode) #fedora-meeting . > > > Thomas Canniot > > -- > Fedora-ambassadors-list mailing list > Fedora-ambassadors-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list > -- Eng. Hisham Isam M. Abdel-Magid Head of Department in charge, Dept. of Shelter & Physical Development (DSPD) Institute for Technological Research (ITR) National Center for Research (NCR) Ministry of Science and Technology (MOST) P.O.Box 2404 Khartoum Sudan Mobile: +249 122 007 122 E.mail: hisham.imam at gmail.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sun Jul 29 14:45:17 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 20:15:17 +0530 Subject: Fedora 8 To Integrate OpenJDK Message-ID: <46ACA7FD.5020209@fedoraproject.org> Hi http://phoronix.com/?page=news_item&px=NTkzMA "One of the most recently added features to the Fedora 8 feature list is IcedTea, which is the open-source version of Java (OpenJDK). The plan is to make IcedTea the default JPackage environment and will replace GCJ. There are Fedora packages for IcedTea already maintained (at ClassPath.org) and the dependencies needed to build IcedTea can already be found in Fedora Rawhide. What's left to be accomplished is resolving issues pertaining to questionable license headers, while lower on the totem pole is integration with the open-source Java web-plugin (gcjwebplugin) followed by PPC and PPC64 support. If IcedTea doesn't make the cut for Fedora 8, GCJ will be left in as the default JPackage environment. More information on the OpenJDK plans for Fedora 8 can be found in the Fedora Project Wiki." http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/IcedTea Rahul From hisham.imam at gmail.com Sun Jul 29 16:12:29 2007 From: hisham.imam at gmail.com (Hisham Abdel-Magid) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 19:12:29 +0300 Subject: [Ambassadors] Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <9d2c731f0707282238g4d7cc48bv81c44166ace2634@mail.gmail.com> References: <9d2c731f0707270855n77724008ie242297f28598377@mail.gmail.com> <46AB3D8C.9080704@fedoraproject.org> <9d2c731f0707281013wb48a31egdf308701efe482d6@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707281224g23a8e99dmf4e79cdd55390dbb@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281446k4437b66wcd48dff3a9702afe@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707281505h347e338bid70193321aabf643@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281528w5cc91c2cq5acbd8a458631786@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281651s6d8fe1aenf6aee2518555b76@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707282238g4d7cc48bv81c44166ace2634@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <59e007ed0707290912u367b21ddr2ee7a028e24f18a4@mail.gmail.com> Two of three : ) http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign (French, r u there??!!) (Arabs, feedback on the translation plz) (Fedoras, comments and remarks plz) (John, I'm thinking of a sort of pamphlet too have all the versions together in one.. i will put the idea on a .pdf file and send it later) eof -- Hisham On 7/29/07, John Babich wrote: > > On 7/29/07, Hisham Abdel-Magid wrote: > > English version> status: updated : ) > > Wow, Hisham, thanks for rising to the challenge! > > I really appreciate it that you are taking the lead on this. > > Best Regards, > > John Babich > Volunteer, Fedora Project > > -- > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sun Jul 29 17:06:09 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 22:36:09 +0530 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux Message-ID: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> Hi It is a Fedora Project rather than a Red Hat specific effort but good to get the word out. http://www.linuxelectrons.com/news/application/10941/red-hat-launches-new-package-repository-enterprise-linux "Red Hat has launched a new package repository for enterprise-class Linux (EL) distributions derived from Fedora, such as Red Hat Enterprise Linux or CentOS, called EPEL. Extra Packages for Enterprise Linux (EPEL) is a community of package maintainers working from inside of Fedora" Rahul From jmbabich at gmail.com Sun Jul 29 19:45:31 2007 From: jmbabich at gmail.com (John Babich) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 22:45:31 +0300 Subject: [Ambassadors] Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <59e007ed0707290912u367b21ddr2ee7a028e24f18a4@mail.gmail.com> References: <9d2c731f0707270855n77724008ie242297f28598377@mail.gmail.com> <46AB3D8C.9080704@fedoraproject.org> <9d2c731f0707281013wb48a31egdf308701efe482d6@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707281224g23a8e99dmf4e79cdd55390dbb@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281446k4437b66wcd48dff3a9702afe@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707281505h347e338bid70193321aabf643@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281528w5cc91c2cq5acbd8a458631786@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707281651s6d8fe1aenf6aee2518555b76@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707282238g4d7cc48bv81c44166ace2634@mail.gmail.com> <59e007ed0707290912u367b21ddr2ee7a028e24f18a4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9d2c731f0707291245w78875b26t68a4b726e94126cc@mail.gmail.com> On 7/29/07, Hisham Abdel-Magid wrote: > Two of three : ) > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign > That's great work. However, one feedback I received was that we should reduce the font size slightly on the list of bullet points and put more space between the lines. > (French, r u there??!!) > Maybe we should concentrate on English and Arabic on one pamphlet - English on the left and Arabic on the right - or on either side of one brochure. > (Arabs, feedback on the translation plz) > Minfudluk > (Fedoras, comments and remarks plz) > Please > (John, I'm thinking of a sort of pamphlet too have all the versions together > in one.. i will put the idea on a .pdf file and send it later) > As I said above, let's concentrate on English and Arabic - By all means, go ahead... Best Regards, John Babich Volunteer, Fedora Project From gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx Sun Jul 29 22:16:03 2007 From: gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx (Gian Paolo Mureddu) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 17:16:03 -0500 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx> Rahul Sundaram escribi?: > Hi > > > It is a Fedora Project rather than a Red Hat specific effort but good > to get the word out. > > http://www.linuxelectrons.com/news/application/10941/red-hat-launches-new-package-repository-enterprise-linux > > > "Red Hat has launched a new package repository for enterprise-class > Linux (EL) distributions derived from Fedora, such as Red Hat > Enterprise Linux or CentOS, called EPEL. Extra Packages for Enterprise > Linux (EPEL) is a community of package maintainers working from inside > of Fedora" > > Rahul > I was reading about this in the Announce ML and thought it was pretty cool, actually. This is *exactly* what Red Hat and CentOS were missing. Now they only have to issue an update batch where they also include as dependencies the required packages to configure these extra repositories in the deployed and supported distributions so users would have to do zero to very little configuration and start using these packages. From tchung at fedoraproject.org Mon Jul 30 02:31:58 2007 From: tchung at fedoraproject.org (Thomas Chung) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 19:31:58 -0700 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod Message-ID: <369bce3b0707291931j33569ac6gb54ea6374a28fc17@mail.gmail.com> (Forwarding message from JoergSimon) ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: JoergSimon To: For discussions about marketing and expanding the Fedora user base Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 22:48:28 +0200 Subject: Re: [Ambassadors] Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod Am Sonntag, 29. Juli 2007 18:12 schrieb Hisham Abdel-Magid: > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign I think in this case, you should not mix the fedora logo and design with the RedHat Logo. You represent Fedora, not Red Hat. This will confuse the visitors - and someone must approve the use of the RedHat Logo to. This is how i interpret http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/Conduct CU Joerg -- J?rg Simon jsimon at fedoraproject.org http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JoergSimon Key Fingerprint: 3691 0989 2DCA 58A2 8D1F 2CAC C823 558E 5B5B 5688 From jmbabich at gmail.com Mon Jul 30 06:44:59 2007 From: jmbabich at gmail.com (John Babich) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 09:44:59 +0300 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <369bce3b0707291931j33569ac6gb54ea6374a28fc17@mail.gmail.com> References: <369bce3b0707291931j33569ac6gb54ea6374a28fc17@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9d2c731f0707292344t1681494fy139afef12639a1e5@mail.gmail.com> On 7/30/07, Thomas Chung wrote: > (Forwarding message from JoergSimon) > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: JoergSimon > To: For discussions about marketing and expanding the Fedora user base > > Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 22:48:28 +0200 > Subject: Re: [Ambassadors] Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod > Am Sonntag, 29. Juli 2007 18:12 schrieb Hisham Abdel-Magid: > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraEvents/GitexExampleSign > > I think in this case, you should not mix the fedora logo and design with the > RedHat Logo. You represent Fedora, not Red Hat. This will confuse the > visitors - and someone must approve the use of the RedHat Logo to. > This is how i interpret > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/Conduct > I believe Joerg is referring to this paragraph: "You represent Fedora, not Red Hat This is pretty simple. You represent the Fedora Project, which is sponsored by Red Hat. You do not represent Red Hat. If someone is interested in RHEL, please put them in touch with a local Red Hat sales engineer. If you need help with that, ask JonFautley. Even though you may believe that Fedora is perfection, you should not insult any other project or product. " I agree 100% with this paragraph. I see two scenarios: Scenario #1: Fedora Project is at an Open Source Conference (such as OSCON) This is crystal-clear. The Fedora Project is the Fedora Project. Period. Scenario #2: Fedora Project is sharing Red Hat exhibition space with Red Hat at an ICT commercial exhibition (such as GITEX) The Fedora Project is clearly sponsored by Red Hat. The Fedora Project is mostly autonomous, but not 100% disconnected from Red Hat. As stated on the main page of the wiki: "The Fedora Project is a collection of projects sponsored by Red Hat, and developed as a partnership between the open source community and Red Hat engineers". In a professional IT setting, such as an ICT exhibition, where the Fedora Project is sharing expensive exhibition space with Red Hat, through the generosity of Red Hat, I think it is appropriate to openly acknowledge Red Hat's sponsorship. In fact, it is a big advantage for an ICT professional to know that the Fedora Project has the clear support of the leading commercial Linux company, Red Hat. At the same time, I plan to clearly identify myself as a Fedoran, since I am not an employee of Red Hat. (A Fedora shirt would be nice). To do otherwise would be deceptive and misleading. If someone asks a Red Hat marketing question (or a technical question for that matter), I will definitely refer them to the Red Hat people sharing the space with me. As for the demo pod poster and literature, I also feel it is appropriate in this context to include the Red Hat logo to reinforce the connection between the Fedora Project and Red Hat, which is a positive association. Best Regards, John Babich Volunteer, Fedora Project From b.j.smith at ieee.org Mon Jul 30 06:54:55 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 02:54:55 -0400 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx> Message-ID: <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> On Sun, 2007-07-29 at 17:16 -0500, Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: > Now they only have to issue an update batch where they also include as > dependencies the required packages to configure these extra repositories > in the deployed and supported distributions so users would have to do > zero to very little configuration and start using these packages. I've re-read this a couple of times and I'm still confused on what you meant by an "update batch"? And provided by whom? Not looking to be critical at all, just wondering what is missing. I'm missing something in what you stated. ;) -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From simon at simline.de Mon Jul 30 07:47:57 2007 From: simon at simline.de (JoergSimon) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 09:47:57 +0200 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <9d2c731f0707292344t1681494fy139afef12639a1e5@mail.gmail.com> References: <369bce3b0707291931j33569ac6gb54ea6374a28fc17@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707292344t1681494fy139afef12639a1e5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200707300948.02146.simon@simline.de> Am Montag, 30. Juli 2007 08:44 schrieb John Babich: > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/Conduct > I agree 100% with this paragraph. > I also feel it is > appropriate in this context to include the Red Hat logo to reinforce > the connection between the Fedora Project and Red Hat, which is a > positive association. In this combination, a Visitor who not know the Fedora Project, will see two Logos in the same hierarchy and size - so what is the correct one? And then the Rection is "ah like OpenSuse" - and this is what we are not ... there are more point hidden in the wiki not to combine it so don't do it. If you must have it. You should send your Proposal to logo at fedoraproject.org. For a short decision ask Max directly - maybe he can approve your Fedora-RedHat Logo-Combination - i would'nt combine it. Cheers Joerg -- J?rg Simon jsimon at fedoraproject.org http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JoergSimon Key Fingerprint: 3691 0989 2DCA 58A2 8D1F 2CAC C823 558E 5B5B 5688 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Jul 30 08:06:30 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 13:36:30 +0530 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Message-ID: <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> Bryan J. Smith wrote: > On Sun, 2007-07-29 at 17:16 -0500, Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: >> Now they only have to issue an update batch where they also include as >> dependencies the required packages to configure these extra repositories >> in the deployed and supported distributions so users would have to do >> zero to very little configuration and start using these packages. > > I've re-read this a couple of times and I'm still confused on what you > meant by an "update batch"? And provided by whom? > He wants Red Hat to include EPEL as a repository by default. By "update batch", he is referring to the sync updates like 5.1. This needs to be discussed with product management. I will let you know if and when there is a change. Rahul From b.j.smith at ieee.org Mon Jul 30 11:22:29 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (=?utf-8?B?QnJ5YW4gSiBTbWl0aA==?=) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 11:22:29 +0000 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod Message-ID: <1954624949-1185794647-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-909846425-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Have to agree about Fedora(TM) and not side-by-side Red Hat(R). There is a reason why Fedora(TM) exists, and there should be no hinting of otherwise. People who don't know Fedora have either: 1. Heard of it 2. Assume the name relates to Red Hat (at least select languages) 3. Won't assume or know anything You don't need to put the Red Hat(R) logo next to Fedora(TM) to add any value or other confusion or gesture that spirals in countless different directions or mindshares. In fact, I think the comment "like OpenSuSE" was a solid knock. Just my $0.02 as an outsider looking in at Red Hat for a good 12 years. Fedora(TM) has its own, standalone, reputation, and it is good. -- Bryan J Smith - mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile From simon at simline.de Mon Jul 30 12:08:46 2007 From: simon at simline.de (JoergSimon) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 14:08:46 +0200 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod In-Reply-To: <1954624949-1185794647-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-909846425-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> References: <1954624949-1185794647-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-909846425-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Message-ID: <200707301408.55252.simon@simline.de> Am Montag, 30. Juli 2007 13:22 schrieb Bryan J Smith: > Have to agree about Fedora(TM) and not side-by-side Red Hat(R). > > In fact, I think the comment "like OpenSuSE" was a solid knock. This was without any valuation. I appreciate the work of Novell on the OpenSuse Projekt. But i also appreciate that RedHat made it possible that we - the Fedora Community - have an own identity. Cheers J?rg -- J?rg Simon jsimon at fedoraproject.org http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JoergSimon Key Fingerprint: 3691 0989 2DCA 58A2 8D1F 2CAC C823 558E 5B5B 5688 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From b.j.smith at ieee.org Mon Jul 30 11:12:36 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (=?utf-8?B?QnJ5YW4gSiBTbWl0aA==?=) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 11:12:36 +0000 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx><1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com><46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <1942413821-1185794054-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-931389797-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Sundaram, Rahul wrote: > He wants Red Hat to include EPEL as a repository by default. > By "update batch", he is referring to the sync updates like 5.1. > This needs to be discussed with product management. > I will let you know if and when there is a change. That's what I thought, but didn't want to assume. Now even as an outsider, I don't see it happening. EPEL throws many wrenches into SLAs and guarantees, among many other things, which we can revisit from RHL days. EPEL is great. EPEL can and should be accommodated as best as possible. But I don't see that going into the product itself, other than maybe the Fedora signing key for security. At least if I was a product manager at Red Hat, that's just the line I would have to draw for SLA reasons. -- Bryan J Smith - mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile -----Original Message----- From: Rahul Sundaram Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 13:36:30 To:For discussions about marketing and expanding the Fedora user base Subject: Re: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux Bryan J. Smith wrote: > On Sun, 2007-07-29 at 17:16 -0500, Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: >> Now they only have to issue an update batch where they also include as >> dependencies the required packages to configure these extra repositories >> in the deployed and supported distributions so users would have to do >> zero to very little configuration and start using these packages. > > I've re-read this a couple of times and I'm still confused on what you > meant by an "update batch"? And provided by whom? > He wants Red Hat to include EPEL as a repository by default. By "update batch", he is referring to the sync updates like 5.1. This needs to be discussed with product management. I will let you know if and when there is a change. Rahul -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list From b.j.smith at ieee.org Mon Jul 30 12:29:26 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 08:29:26 -0400 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod -- here we go ... In-Reply-To: <200707301408.55252.simon@simline.de> References: <1954624949-1185794647-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-909846425-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <200707301408.55252.simon@simline.de> Message-ID: <1185798566.3596.9.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Am Montag, 30. Juli 2007 13:22 schrieb Bryan J Smith: > Have to agree about Fedora(TM) and not side-by-side Red Hat(R). > In fact, I think the comment "like OpenSuSE" was a solid knock. On Mon, 2007-07-30 at 14:08 +0200, JoergSimon wrote: > This was without any valuation. I appreciate the work of Novell on the > OpenSuse Projekt. This is what I can't stand about the Linux community sometimes. What I say is _not_ what others take it as, and I end up defending myself over and over. Especially when I make a statement or viewpoint that is taken _utterly_ "out of context" -- let alone when I make a "unpopular viewpoint" (see below). First off, understand I was _not_ "knocking" Novell or OpenSuSE. Secondly, the "knock" was that it was "sound" (as in "solid wood"). There are _distinct_ differences between OpenSuSE and Novell, Fedora and Red Hat, heck even Debian and the DCC. They are not 1:1 comparisons, even if people try to make them. Third, in this case, the originally person was "on the mark" in trying _not_ to "side brand" Fedora(TM) as Red Hat(R) much like many are accustomed to with SuSE(R) and Novell(R) (and yes, I understand the cap is different on SUSE/suse now). Lastly, I have had to -- in a professional and near-_legally_ (as my _paid_ job function) even _explain_ Novell, Microsoft and -- gasp -- SCO (v. IBM on Monterey, not the "forged" SCO v. Linux non-sense) at times! I have seen the "wraith" of people who think I "defend" Novell, Microsoft, even SCO to the point of causing some people to get _fixated_ on me to levels of not only unethical, but even _illegal_ activity. And damn me when I am I critical of the "oh, the great Linux savor IBM." Please, _please_ do _not_ add to the "rabid" nature of the community sometimes by assuming what I say is what you take it as. I know you weren't attacking me (unlike those "select" others with no ethics), but you were doing the reverse. You were defending Novell/SuSE when there was _no_ such "insult." > But i also appreciate that RedHat made it possible that we - the Fedora > Community - have an own identity. *MY* point *EXACTLY*! Now I'm going to STFU because I can't seem to make a (pun)"sound"(pun) statement and not see it taking utterly wrong. Sigh, I know _better_ to just put my consulting mouth where it is and _not_ deal with these "advocacy" forums because all I do is indirectly piss people off. Sigh. -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Jul 30 12:35:02 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 18:05:02 +0530 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <1942413821-1185794054-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-931389797-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx><1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com><46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> <1942413821-1185794054-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-931389797-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Message-ID: <46ADDAF6.1070701@fedoraproject.org> Bryan J Smith wrote: > > At least if I was a product manager at Red Hat, > that's just the line I would have to draw for SLA reasons. > Good thing you aren't and Daniel Riek is ;-).Seriously though, the SLA might be a hurdle and this is one of the reasons I clarified it in the EPEL FAQ and some notes can be added within the repository file and other places too. With the current state, EPEL has low visibility for RHEL users and we will be discussing that with product management folks. Rahul From b.j.smith at ieee.org Mon Jul 30 12:55:18 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 08:55:18 -0400 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <46ADDAF6.1070701@fedoraproject.org> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> <1942413821-1185794054-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-931389797-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <46ADDAF6.1070701@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <1185800118.4465.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> On Mon, 2007-07-30 at 18:05 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Good thing you aren't and Daniel Riek is ;-). I'm just an outsider. I have no idea what Red Hat's foci are. I can only make ignorant assumptions. ;) > Seriously though, the SLA might be a hurdle and this is one of the > reasons I clarified it in the EPEL FAQ and some notes can be added > within the repository file and other places too. I know. At the same time, if I was a Red Hat consultant on client site, I wouldn't have to deal with the pressure of a SLA only to find out there was breakage caused by EPEL. I'm not saying EPEL will "break," but from the "anal power," there is that "risk." I'm not trying to knock the outstanding work of the greater Fedora Project, of which I have been signing praises for a long, long time -- ever since Red Hat Linux 10 Beta became Fedora [1] Test. I'm a well-known Red Hat apologist (and Novell apologist, etc... -- much to my own demise at the hands of some very unethical people and illegal actions). > With the current state, EPEL has low visibility for RHEL users and we > will be discussing that with product management folks. Understand. Sorry if my commentary caused you any grief or issues on your end. -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From b.j.smith at ieee.org Mon Jul 30 12:56:33 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 08:56:33 -0400 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod -- my apologies ... In-Reply-To: <1185798566.3596.9.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> References: <1954624949-1185794647-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-909846425-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <200707301408.55252.simon@simline.de> <1185798566.3596.9.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Message-ID: <1185800193.4465.6.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> On Mon, 2007-07-30 at 08:29 -0400, Bryan J. Smith wrote: > Lastly, I have had to -- in a professional and near-_legally_ (as my > _paid_ job function) even _explain_ Novell, Microsoft and -- gasp -- SCO > (v. IBM on Monterey, not the "forged" SCO v. Linux non-sense) at times! > I have seen the "wraith" of people who think I "defend" Novell, > Microsoft, even SCO to the point of causing some people to get _fixated_ > on me to levels of not only unethical, but even _illegal_ activity. And > damn me when I am I critical of the "oh, the great Linux savor IBM." My apologies for this "bark." I've just paid a "heavy price" with people I refer to as "the 97%" by attempting to "explain" Novell recently. Sigh, there was nothing better for the GPL from the SuSE avenue than when Novell bought SuSE. -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From simon at simline.de Mon Jul 30 13:16:50 2007 From: simon at simline.de (JoergSimon) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 15:16:50 +0200 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod -- here we go ... In-Reply-To: <1185798566.3596.9.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> References: <1954624949-1185794647-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-909846425-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <200707301408.55252.simon@simline.de> <1185798566.3596.9.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Message-ID: <200707301516.56021.simon@simline.de> Am Montag, 30. Juli 2007 14:29 schrieb Bryan J. Smith: > Am Montag, 30. Juli 2007 13:22 schrieb Bryan J Smith: > > Have to agree about Fedora(TM) and not side-by-side Red Hat(R). > > In fact, I think the comment "like OpenSuSE" was a solid knock. > > On Mon, 2007-07-30 at 14:08 +0200, JoergSimon wrote: > > This was without any valuation. I appreciate the work of Novell on the > > OpenSuse Projekt. > > This is what I can't stand about the Linux community sometimes. What I > say is _not_ what others take it as, and I end up defending myself over > and over. Especially when I make a statement or viewpoint that is taken > _utterly_ "out of context" -- let alone when I make a "unpopular > viewpoint" (see below). > > First off, understand I was _not_ "knocking" Novell or OpenSuSE. I wrongly interpreted your "solid knock" - /me should increase english skills :-) CU J?rg -- J?rg Simon jsimon at fedoraproject.org http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JoergSimon Key Fingerprint: 3691 0989 2DCA 58A2 8D1F 2CAC C823 558E 5B5B 5688 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From hisham.imam at gmail.com Mon Jul 30 13:21:30 2007 From: hisham.imam at gmail.com (Hisham Abdel-Magid) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 16:21:30 +0300 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod -- here we go ... In-Reply-To: <200707301516.56021.simon@simline.de> References: <1954624949-1185794647-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-909846425-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <200707301408.55252.simon@simline.de> <1185798566.3596.9.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <200707301516.56021.simon@simline.de> Message-ID: <59e007ed0707300621s7484c9afobff73ed4849036e3@mail.gmail.com> i am loosing track : | what to do with the "GITEX sign" as a bottom line : ) with/without RH logo? Hisham On 7/30/07, JoergSimon wrote: > > Am Montag, 30. Juli 2007 14:29 schrieb Bryan J. Smith: > > Am Montag, 30. Juli 2007 13:22 schrieb Bryan J Smith: > > > Have to agree about Fedora(TM) and not side-by-side Red Hat(R). > > > In fact, I think the comment "like OpenSuSE" was a solid knock. > > > > On Mon, 2007-07-30 at 14:08 +0200, JoergSimon wrote: > > > This was without any valuation. I appreciate the work of Novell on the > > > OpenSuse Projekt. > > > > This is what I can't stand about the Linux community sometimes. What I > > say is _not_ what others take it as, and I end up defending myself over > > and over. Especially when I make a statement or viewpoint that is taken > > _utterly_ "out of context" -- let alone when I make a "unpopular > > viewpoint" (see below). > > > > First off, understand I was _not_ "knocking" Novell or OpenSuSE. > > I wrongly interpreted your "solid knock" - > /me should increase english skills :-) > > CU J?rg > > -- > > J?rg Simon > jsimon at fedoraproject.org > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JoergSimon > Key Fingerprint: > 3691 0989 2DCA 58A2 8D1F 2CAC C823 558E 5B5B 5688 > > -- > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chitlesh at fedoraproject.org Mon Jul 30 14:46:24 2007 From: chitlesh at fedoraproject.org (Chitlesh GOORAH) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 16:46:24 +0200 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod -- here we go ... In-Reply-To: <59e007ed0707300621s7484c9afobff73ed4849036e3@mail.gmail.com> References: <1954624949-1185794647-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-909846425-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <200707301408.55252.simon@simline.de> <1185798566.3596.9.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <200707301516.56021.simon@simline.de> <59e007ed0707300621s7484c9afobff73ed4849036e3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <13dbfe4f0707300746u3d06f0eds640c2127f721d049@mail.gmail.com> On 7/30/07, Hisham Abdel-Magid wrote: > > i am loosing track : | > > what to do with the "GITEX sign" as a bottom line : ) > with/without RH logo? > Without RH logo. ! Why ? following John Babich discussion, some of us had some difficulties in organizing fedora booths at certain events in the past, just because Fedora was too related to Red Hat. Some organizers pointed to the direct influence of Red Hat in fedora's marketing team. At that time, we hadn't much choice than to accept and pay high price for the booth. Most of the work done by the local ambassadors were in vain since we couldn't afford to pay more. Time was wasted. Now things have changed in the fedora community, but in some people's mind it isn't. So I strongly request you to avoid using Red Hat logo next to Fedora's in the future. Please don't complicate the life of other fedora ambassadors. Chitlesh -- http://clunixchit.blogspot.com From jmbabich at gmail.com Mon Jul 30 15:40:22 2007 From: jmbabich at gmail.com (John Babich) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 18:40:22 +0300 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod -- here we go ... In-Reply-To: <13dbfe4f0707300746u3d06f0eds640c2127f721d049@mail.gmail.com> References: <1954624949-1185794647-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-909846425-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <200707301408.55252.simon@simline.de> <1185798566.3596.9.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <200707301516.56021.simon@simline.de> <59e007ed0707300621s7484c9afobff73ed4849036e3@mail.gmail.com> <13dbfe4f0707300746u3d06f0eds640c2127f721d049@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9d2c731f0707300840l4834ec7dn9c6c5ef058f12ffc@mail.gmail.com> On 7/30/07, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote: > Without RH logo. ! > > Why ? following John Babich discussion, some of us had some > difficulties in organizing fedora booths at certain events in the > past, just because Fedora was too related to Red Hat. > > Some organizers pointed to the direct influence of Red Hat in fedora's > marketing team. At that time, we hadn't much choice than to accept and > pay high price for the booth. > I wasn't aware of this... > Most of the work done by the local ambassadors were in vain since we > couldn't afford to pay more. Time was wasted. > > Now things have changed in the fedora community, but in some people's > mind it isn't. So I strongly request you to avoid using Red Hat logo > next to Fedora's in the future. > > Please don't complicate the life of other fedora ambassadors. > That's the best argument I heard so far. Life is complicated enough. If it will cause harm to the efforts of other Fedora Ambassadors, then I want to avoid that by all means. Fedora's identity separate from Red Hat is important. The fact we will be in the same booth as Red Hat should be enough of a connection as it is. Therefore, I will remove the Red Hat logo from poster and the flyers. Thanks, everyone, for keeping the discussion civil. Best Regards, John Babich Volunteer, Fedora Project From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Jul 30 17:12:23 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 22:42:23 +0530 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod -- here we go ... In-Reply-To: <9d2c731f0707300840l4834ec7dn9c6c5ef058f12ffc@mail.gmail.com> References: <1954624949-1185794647-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-909846425-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <200707301408.55252.simon@simline.de> <1185798566.3596.9.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <200707301516.56021.simon@simline.de> <59e007ed0707300621s7484c9afobff73ed4849036e3@mail.gmail.com> <13dbfe4f0707300746u3d06f0eds640c2127f721d049@mail.gmail.com> <9d2c731f0707300840l4834ec7dn9c6c5ef058f12ffc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <46AE1BF7.5080702@fedoraproject.org> John Babich wrote: > On 7/30/07, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote: > >> Without RH logo. ! >> >> Why ? following John Babich discussion, some of us had some >> difficulties in organizing fedora booths at certain events in the >> past, just because Fedora was too related to Red Hat. >> >> Some organizers pointed to the direct influence of Red Hat in fedora's >> marketing team. At that time, we hadn't much choice than to accept and >> pay high price for the booth. >> > > I wasn't aware of this... To clarify on that, in some conferences non-commercial or volunteer entities are charged lower or given free booth space while commercial entities are charged usually heavily to compensate for free both space to others. This in general is a good scheme except that some organizers refuse to consider Fedora as a volunteer community vis-a-vis it's relationship to Red Hat. Red Hat does not allocate a huge budget that is Fedora specific because it considers Fedora as more of as a community effort and not a commercial product. This means Red Hat or Fedora volunteers end up footing a higher bill than necessary. If we can avoid that problems, these funds can be used for a greater good. In a conference that was organized in my region separate booths in different places were setup for Fedora and Red Hat. One potential problem with this setup is that some people are not aware of any relationships and end up asking questions like "How do you compete with Red Hat?". If you manage to communicate the relationships in your introductions while avoiding the pitfalls, that would be the ideal solution. Rahul From b.j.smith at ieee.org Mon Jul 30 17:23:47 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 13:23:47 -0400 Subject: Fedora Project Sign for GITEX Demo Pod -- here we go ... In-Reply-To: <13dbfe4f0707300746u3d06f0eds640c2127f721d049@mail.gmail.com> References: <1954624949-1185794647-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-909846425-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <200707301408.55252.simon@simline.de> <1185798566.3596.9.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <200707301516.56021.simon@simline.de> <59e007ed0707300621s7484c9afobff73ed4849036e3@mail.gmail.com> <13dbfe4f0707300746u3d06f0eds640c2127f721d049@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1185816227.3533.9.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> On Mon, 2007-07-30 at 16:46 +0200, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote: > Without RH logo. ! > Why ? following John Babich discussion, some of us had some > difficulties in organizing fedora booths at certain events in the > past, just because Fedora was too related to Red Hat. > Some organizers pointed to the direct influence of Red Hat in fedora's > marketing team. At that time, we hadn't much choice than to accept and > pay high price for the booth. As Daimler learned from the UAW at Chrysler, if they think you have money, they will ask for it. Now that it's no longer Daimler-Chrysler and just Chrysler, the UAW ain't asking for it any more. Why? Because they still need Chrysler, their employer. ;) Same deal. Events will ask for money from Fedora(TM) if they think Red Hat(R) will provide. If Red Hat(R) will not, then they will still invite Fedora(TM). Why? Because the events still need Fedora(TM). ;) > Most of the work done by the local ambassadors were in vain since we > couldn't afford to pay more. Time was wasted. > Now things have changed in the fedora community, but in some people's > mind it isn't. So I strongly request you to avoid using Red Hat logo > next to Fedora's in the future. > Please don't complicate the life of other fedora ambassadors. I really need to write an "unofficial/non-sanctioned" Fedora(TM) and Red Hat(R) FAQ like I did in the past to explain this stuff. I would open it up for commentary for accuracy, etc... Until then ... Fedora(TM) exists for a reason, many times on its own ;) -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Jul 30 22:15:27 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2007 03:45:27 +0530 Subject: Linux: Redirecting Core Dumps Message-ID: <46AE62FF.6010800@fedoraproject.org> Hi Apport is a system wide crash dump handler. Will Woods, QA lead in Fedora has been working on adopting Apport from Ubuntu and Neil Horman is pushing some reimplemented patches upstream that is required for this feature in true Fedora fashion. Originally targeted for the next release, this has now been moved to Fedora 9. A important feature that will make it easy for users to report issues. Good to keep an eye on. http://kerneltrap.org/node/14010 Neil pointed to Ubuntu's Apport, "Ubuntu has implemented lots of their functionality with some patches that they never pushed upstream (and IMHO, have some security issues). This is my attempt to do what their doing sanely, so the other distro's (primarily fedora) can take advantage of this technology." http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureApport Rahul From gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx Tue Jul 31 02:01:00 2007 From: gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx (Gian Paolo Mureddu) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 21:01:00 -0500 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <46AE97DC.5020009@prodigy.net.mx> Rahul Sundaram escribi?: > Bryan J. Smith wrote: >> On Sun, 2007-07-29 at 17:16 -0500, Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: >>> Now they only have to issue an update batch where they also include >>> as dependencies the required packages to configure these extra >>> repositories in the deployed and supported distributions so users >>> would have to do zero to very little configuration and start using >>> these packages. >> >> I've re-read this a couple of times and I'm still confused on what you >> meant by an "update batch"? And provided by whom? >> > > He wants Red Hat to include EPEL as a repository by default. By > "update batch", he is referring to the sync updates like 5.1. This > needs to be discussed with product management. I will let you know if > and when there is a change. > > Rahul > Yes, that's exactly what I meant. Though from the discussion you two are having, it may seem as if this is going to be an "at your own risk" sort of thing for RHEL users. I certainly hope it will not be that way. Make EPEL move as slowly as RHEL and to test each package as thoroughly as they test each RHEL release, just bring the myriad of awesome packages that live in the repos to RHEL users. I'd venture to guess that this would be a good thing for corporate desktop users, and even those few who choose to user RHEL for their home systems. From b.j.smith at ieee.org Tue Jul 31 02:23:59 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 22:23:59 -0400 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <46AE97DC.5020009@prodigy.net.mx> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> <46AE97DC.5020009@prodigy.net.mx> Message-ID: <1185848639.5280.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> On Mon, 2007-07-30 at 21:01 -0500, Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: > Though from the discussion you two are having, it may seem as if this is > going to be an "at your own risk" sort of thing for RHEL users. I > certainly hope it will not be that way. There is a huge difference between a "7 year RHEL maintained package" (with full SLA option) and a "Fedora package maintainer." I have no problem with EPEL as an offering. But I don't see it going into RHEL as "stock" -- especially not at the "update" level. As I hinted before, the last thing I'd want to do deal with if I was a Red Hat consultant is a failed update due to a deprecated/unmaintained EPEL package. > Make EPEL move as slowly as RHEL and to test each package as thoroughly > as they test each RHEL release, Then at what point do RHEL maintainers just take over the package? Unless I'm mistaken, it's hard for Red Hat to rely on Fedora maintainers when it comes to RHEL. I know there are many inside of Red Hat that _do_ wear _both_ hats. But while virtually any RHEL package is in Fedora, it's _not_ the other way around -- very not so! ;) I don't see how EPEL can be anything but an augment, not a standard, part of RHEL. I honestly don't. CentOS, different story. But as far as RHEL, I don't see it. > just bring the myriad of awesome packages that live in the repos to RHEL > users. I'd venture to guess that this would be a good thing for > corporate desktop users, and even those few who choose to user RHEL for > their home systems. Then you don't understand the focus of RHEL -- at least as I've come to know it. RHEL's focus is _not_ the same as CentOS, despite CentOS being built from RHEL. That is the _key_ to understanding my point. ;-> RHEL is _not_ about package availability. It's about guaranteed ABI/API compatibility, integration testing, regression mitigation, etc..., with optional SLAs, for 7 years. But I'm just an outsider, and don't speak for anyone but myself and my exposure. -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From kwade at redhat.com Tue Jul 31 05:01:09 2007 From: kwade at redhat.com (Karsten Wade) Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 22:01:09 -0700 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <1185800118.4465.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> <1942413821-1185794054-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-931389797-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <46ADDAF6.1070701@fedoraproject.org> <1185800118.4465.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Message-ID: <1185858069.3521.82.camel@erato.phig.org> On Mon, 2007-07-30 at 08:55 -0400, Bryan J. Smith wrote: > I know. At the same time, if I was a Red Hat consultant on client site, > I wouldn't have to deal with the pressure of a SLA only to find out > there was breakage caused by EPEL. I'm not saying EPEL will "break," > but from the "anal power," there is that "risk." Well, we know this happens anyway, just people are pulling (and rebuilding) packages from all sorts of random locations. EPEL is actually a great way for a consultant to help a company get a desired package available. One of the reasons for this "standard job description": http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/PackageMaintainer/GenericJobDescription - Karsten -- Karsten Wade, 108 Editor ^ Fedora Documentation Project Sr. Developer Relations Mgr. | fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject quaid.108.redhat.com | gpg key: AD0E0C41 ////////////////////////////////// \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From b.j.smith at ieee.org Tue Jul 31 12:22:10 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2007 08:22:10 -0400 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <1185858069.3521.82.camel@erato.phig.org> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> <1942413821-1185794054-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-931389797-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <46ADDAF6.1070701@fedoraproject.org> <1185800118.4465.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <1185858069.3521.82.camel@erato.phig.org> Message-ID: <1185884530.3903.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> On Mon, 2007-07-30 at 22:01 -0700, Karsten Wade wrote: > Well, we know this happens anyway, just people are pulling (and > rebuilding) packages from all sorts of random locations. Oh, I wholly agree this is drastically improved. The Fedora standards and processes are much, much better than your typical "oh, it built" attitude of select RPMForge/3rd Party repositories. > EPEL is actually a great way for a consultant to help a company get a > desired package available. One of the reasons for this "standard job > description": > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/PackageMaintainer/GenericJobDescription An EPEL package could become stale or otherwise cause an update to fail, etc... Especially if it is a dependency for another EPEL package that is still being maintained, etc... Now I understand there are no "alternative" packages to what is in RHEL and no RHEL package can be replaced or dependent on a EPEL package. But there's still that issue. -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From wolfy at nobugconsulting.ro Tue Jul 31 14:54:30 2007 From: wolfy at nobugconsulting.ro (Manuel Wolfshant) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2007 17:54:30 +0300 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <1185884530.3903.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> <1942413821-1185794054-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-931389797-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <46ADDAF6.1070701@fedoraproject.org> <1185800118.4465.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <1185858069.3521.82.camel@erato.phig.org> <1185884530.3903.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Message-ID: <46AF4D26.20606@nobugconsulting.ro> Bryan J. Smith wrote: > On Mon, 2007-07-30 at 22:01 -0700, Karsten Wade wrote: > >> Well, we know this happens anyway, just people are pulling (and >> rebuilding) packages from all sorts of random locations. >> > > Oh, I wholly agree this is drastically improved. The Fedora standards > and processes are much, much better than your typical "oh, it built" > attitude of select RPMForge/3rd Party repositories. > Sorry to contradict you, but you are not fair. The attitude in major 3rd party repos is far from "oh, it built". I am constantly using several of them (especially rpmforge, sometimes atrpms, centosplus and kb) for a couple of years and the number of problems created by them was very very low. And the quality of specs for many of the packages in those repositories is lots of times excellent. I know I repeat myself, but axel, dag,dries, hughes jr, karanbir,and thias (alphabetically listed) do a great job and I am once again happy to extend my thanks to them for their work. >> EPEL is actually a great way for a consultant to help a company get a >> desired package available. One of the reasons for this "standard job >> description": >> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/PackageMaintainer/GenericJobDescription >> > > An EPEL package could become stale or otherwise cause an update to fail, > etc... Especially if it is a dependency for another EPEL package that > is still being maintained, etc... > > Now I understand there are no "alternative" packages to what is in RHEL > and no RHEL package can be replaced or dependent on a EPEL package. But > there's still that issue. EPEL is just an effort to bring in the RHEL world the packages from the former Fedora Extras while also trying to the best of our (I speak now as a Fedora Collection maintainer and as a member of EPEL SIG ) abilities to also respect the long term commitment of RHEL (in terms of ABI etc). From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Tue Jul 31 15:27:09 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2007 20:57:09 +0530 Subject: New extras repository for Red Hat Enteprise Linux Message-ID: <46AF54CD.4040107@fedoraproject.org> Hi EPEL moves ahead... http://www.linux.com/feature/118304 If you need a software app that is not included or supported in the standard Red Hat Enterprise Linux (RHEL) or CentOS distribution, Red Hat's new Extra Packages for Enterprise Linux (EPEL) repository might be an excellent place to go fishing. RahulNew extras repository for Red Hat Enteprise Linux From b.j.smith at ieee.org Tue Jul 31 17:33:09 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2007 13:33:09 -0400 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <46AF4D26.20606@nobugconsulting.ro> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> <1942413821-1185794054-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-931389797-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <46ADDAF6.1070701@fedoraproject.org> <1185800118.4465.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <1185858069.3521.82.camel@erato.phig.org> <1185884530.3903.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AF4D26.20606@nobugconsulting.ro> Message-ID: <1185903189.3551.64.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> On Tue, 2007-07-31 at 17:54 +0300, Manuel Wolfshant wrote: > Sorry to contradict you, but you are not fair. The attitude in major 3rd > party repos is far from "oh, it built". I specifically said "select RPMForge/3rd Party repositories". ^^^^^^ I *DO* give kudos to _several_ RPMForge/3rd Party repositories when it is due. That's why I said "select". _Remember_ my context here, RHEL with optional SLAs. ;) But there *ARE* _several_ ones that do not want to deal with Red Hat/Fedora processes. They were quite critical of them when Fedora Extras first started up. I was rather disgusted at the "attitudes" they had towards Red Hat's "requirements" on Fedora Extras, because it was about ensuring some basic level of integration testing, not just "a package dump." > I am constantly using several of them (especially rpmforge, sometimes > atrpms, centosplus and kb) First off, I have _nothing_ negative to say about "CentOS Plus" (some of the more "fringe" CentOS stuff is another story though -- thank God for EPEL ;). Secondly, I use ATrpms myself too. But, third, I do _not_ put _either_ of them in my YUM repo.d blindly. If I do, I pigeon-hole them for _specific_ RPMs (e.g., madwifi). Which all goes to ... fourth ... I wouldn't like the idea of doing a RHEL update at a client under SLA contract when they have various EPEL packages installed (much less RPMForge/3rd Party). > And the quality of specs for many of the packages in those > repositories is lots of times excellent. A SPEC file might be well designed (and I *DO* like RPMForge for that -- good "peer support"), but that doesn't mean the end product is still well integration tested. ;) In other words, when I tap a SPEC file, I don't merely just "build and release." I actually do an integration and regression test. There is a reason why Red Hat backports fixes for RHEL packages. Are EPEL maintainers going to do the same to guarantee 7 years for complete ABI/API compatibility? Microsoft constantly harps on the reality that independent software quality is one thing, but integration and regression testing is another. They are correct. At the same time, their statements are rather self-defeating when you start comparing Windows Professional or Server to RHEL/RHD -- because you get both individual software quality combined with integration and regression testing and a massive effort to ensure long-term ABI/API compatibility to an anal power. [ SIDE NOTE: The key to combating Microsoft FUD is not to call their statements lies, but to explain them. In the overwhelming majority of cases, their own FUD is their worst enemy. ] > I know I repeat myself, but axel, dag,dries, hughes jr, karanbir,and thias > (alphabetically listed) do a great job and I am once again happy to > extend my thanks to them for their work. Sigh ... I'm _so_tired_ of seeing my words twisted into things they are _not_. No offense, but since some people don't seem to "get it" ... 1. I didn't build my consulting rep on just "oh, I got this package and it works!" At the same time ... 2. Just because I don't put Axel, DAG, Dries, etc... in my default YUM repos does *NOT* mean I don't think they are excellent resources or use them regularly. *PLEASE* stop reading into my statements! > EPEL is just an effort to bring in the RHEL world the packages from the > former Fedora Extras while also trying to the best of our (I speak now > as a Fedora Collection maintainer and as a member of EPEL SIG ) > abilities to also respect the long term commitment of RHEL (in terms of > ABI etc). And I _do_ appreciate that. But there is a "line to be drawn." At some point, the "convenience" of putting EPEL in as a "default repository" in RHEL might also be a _burden_ on Red Hat, its consultants and those who implement its SLA guarantees. ;) That's _all_ I was pointing out. Sigh. I guess I just spent too many years in defense and aerospace systems. ;) -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From b.j.smith at ieee.org Tue Jul 31 17:49:42 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2007 13:49:42 -0400 Subject: Mitigating risk -- WAS: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <1185903189.3551.64.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> <1942413821-1185794054-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-931389797-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <46ADDAF6.1070701@fedoraproject.org> <1185800118.4465.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <1185858069.3521.82.camel@erato.phig.org> <1185884530.3903.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AF4D26.20606@nobugconsulting.ro> <1185903189.3551.64.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Message-ID: <1185904182.5771.13.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> On Tue, 2007-07-31 at 13:33 -0400, Bryan J. Smith wrote: > I *DO* give kudos to _several_ RPMForge/3rd Party repositories when it > is due. That's why I said "select". _Remember_ my context here, RHEL > with optional SLAs. ;) > ... > Sigh ... I'm _so_tired_ of seeing my words twisted into things they are > _not_. No offense, but since some people don't seem to "get it" ... > 1. I didn't build my consulting rep on just "oh, I got this package and > it works!" At the same time ... > 2. Just because I don't put Axel, DAG, Dries, etc... in my default YUM > repos does *NOT* mean I don't think they are excellent resources or use > them regularly. > *PLEASE* stop reading into my statements! In re-reading several posts again, just to ensure I wasn't "wrong" in my analysis and responses, I want to point out the thing people aren't seeing what I'm saying. My #1 job, as an enterprise Linux consultant -- more than anything -- is to "mitigate risk." That transcends "convenience." That is what defines my statements. People are taking "offense" to my statements, no matter how I try to qualify with them with prefixes like "select" or otherwise. No matter how I try to make it about "risk." It's not that I'm saying anything is "broken" or "wrong," but about "risk." And if that still doesn't explain what I'm trying to say, then maybe a little'ole "devil's advocate" is all I'm doing. I.e., - Adding anything not in RHEL or certified against it is a risk - Having additional packages added to RHEL is a risk when updating - EPEL mitigates some of that risk more than independent repositories - But EPEL still doesn't have the guarantees of RHEL itself That is _all_. That's not to criticize anyone. There's _no_way_ RPMForge/3rd Party repositories could even attempt to address the level of risk I'm talking about. And that's not to say there is no place for them. In fact, I _truly_appreciate_ (and _professionally_ use) RPMForge myself. And if that still doesn't explain "why," understand this whole "exchange" started with this post ... https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-marketing-list/2007-July/msg00071.html With my response asking for "clarification" ... https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-marketing-list/2007-July/msg00074.html And Rahul's "verification" of what I thought he said (or as Rahul interpreted, which I thought was correct, but I wanted someone else to verify they saw it as I did) ... https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-marketing-list/2007-July/msg00076.html Now if that doesn't explain why I have been responding, I don't know what will. It's threads like this that I get the label of "jerk" by many people. At the same time, it's also threads like this that I get a _lot_ of work too. ;) Why? Because what may matter to 97% of the community is not what matters to another 3%. And those 3% are the people who pay my mortgage. I am _not_ criticizing the efforts of _anyone_, I'm merely pointing out why EPEL may not be "enabled" by default in RHEL. And that's where my focus is. Because I built my reputation on that 3%, even if I've managed to piss off 97%. Not my intent at all, and I wish people would stop interpreting my "risk" comments which, are indeed sometimes "critical" (but very _exact_ and _qualifying_), as a "dislike." It's so far from the truth it's not even funny! E.g., I couldn't live without RPMForge. But, at the same time, I think RHEL should live without EPEL "enabled" by default. If you can't see that careful, critical analysis by myself, I don't know what to tell you. I'm not trying to insult or belittle anyone. But just point out that when it comes to my job -- risk mitigation -- I have to make hard choices. As always, I'm an outsider and don't speak for anyone but myself. -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From jkeating at j2solutions.net Tue Jul 31 18:03:13 2007 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2007 14:03:13 -0400 Subject: Mitigating risk -- WAS: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <1185904182.5771.13.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <46AD11A3.9050909@prodigy.net.mx> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> <1942413821-1185794054-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-931389797-@bxe116.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <46ADDAF6.1070701@fedoraproject.org> <1185800118.4465.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <1185858069.3521.82.camel@erato.phig.org> <1185884530.3903.3.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AF4D26.20606@nobugconsulting.ro> <1185903189.3551.64.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <1185904182.5771.13.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Message-ID: <20070731140313.2099b7d2@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 31 Jul 2007 13:49:42 -0400 "Bryan J. Smith" wrote: > And if that still doesn't explain what I'm trying to say, then maybe a > little'ole "devil's advocate" is all I'm doing. I.e., > > - Adding anything not in RHEL or certified against it is a risk > - Having additional packages added to RHEL is a risk when updating > - EPEL mitigates some of that risk more than independent repositories > - But EPEL still doesn't have the guarantees of RHEL itself I have to agree 100%. -- Jesse Keating RHCE (jkeating.livejournal.com) Fedora Project (fedoraproject.org/wiki/JesseKeating) GPG Public Key (geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Tue Jul 31 18:06:21 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2007 23:36:21 +0530 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <46AE97DC.5020009@prodigy.net.mx> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> <46AE97DC.5020009@prodigy.net.mx> Message-ID: <46AF7A1D.9020101@fedoraproject.org> Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: >> > Yes, that's exactly what I meant. > > Though from the discussion you two are having, it may seem as if this is > going to be an "at your own risk" sort of thing for RHEL users. Yes. That is the *best* we can hope for. RHEL is a commercial product that comes with support, warranty and services with tedious level of backporting, testing etc that guarantees a level of ABI compatibility, hardware and software certifications and that is it's value over the hundreds of other distributions out there. These are legally enforceable requirements specified in a contract. Anything that is not directly maintained is going to be automatically excluded. Some security certifications also require you all the software and every single check in a product to be done by a single vendor and you need to able to verify and prove that to get certified and without those certifications you are excluded from some specific markets - defense, government, financial etc. So yes, EPEL is not going to be treated as part of the same product with commercial support regardless of it's quality since it is volunteer work. See EPEL FAQ for more details. Rahul From b.j.smith at ieee.org Tue Jul 31 18:18:15 2007 From: b.j.smith at ieee.org (Bryan J. Smith) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2007 14:18:15 -0400 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <46AF7A1D.9020101@fedoraproject.org> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> <46AE97DC.5020009@prodigy.net.mx> <46AF7A1D.9020101@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <1185905895.5771.30.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> On Tue, 2007-07-31 at 23:36 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > So yes, EPEL is not going to be treated as part of the same product with > commercial support regardless of it's quality since it is volunteer > work. See EPEL FAQ for more details. And that's the "hard part" when it comes to selling portions of Red Hat on "enabling" EPEL by default. Even "harder" is the very question originally brought up (now re-phrased by myself here) ... How does one mitigate risk of updating RHEL _with_ EPEL? Especially if and when SLAs are involved? Understand everything I'm pointing out is not just to "be a jerk." And it's not just to play "devil's advocate." Hell, I'm not even really trying to "be Red Hat" in asking those question. Of more consideration and direct actions by myself ... Can I get my clients the non-RHEL/non-certified software they need? And without putting any additional burden on Red Hat and their SLAs? That's not being critical of any efforts by Fedora or any 3rd Parties. That's being critical of the risks involved, period, with the utmost consideration of not just my clients, not just Red Hat, but Fedora volunteers. Anyway, time for me to STFU. ;) -- Bryan J. Smith Professional, Technical Annoyance mailto:b.j.smith at ieee.org http://thebs413.blogspot.com -------------------------------------------------------- Fission Power: An Inconvenient Solution From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Tue Jul 31 18:38:18 2007 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 01 Aug 2007 00:08:18 +0530 Subject: Red Hat Launches New Package Repository for Enterprise Linux In-Reply-To: <1185905895.5771.30.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> References: <46ACC901.2090408@fedoraproject.org> <1185778495.3560.8.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> <46AD9C06.1070803@fedoraproject.org> <46AE97DC.5020009@prodigy.net.mx> <46AF7A1D.9020101@fedoraproject.org> <1185905895.5771.30.camel@portatux64.mobile.smithconcepts.com> Message-ID: <46AF819A.3060700@fedoraproject.org> Bryan J. Smith wrote: > On Tue, 2007-07-31 at 23:36 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote: >> So yes, EPEL is not going to be treated as part of the same product with >> commercial support regardless of it's quality since it is volunteer >> work. See EPEL FAQ for more details. > > And that's the "hard part" when it comes to selling portions of Red Hat > on "enabling" EPEL by default. Even "harder" is the very question > originally brought up (now re-phrased by myself here) ... > > How does one mitigate risk of updating RHEL _with_ EPEL? > Especially if and when SLAs are involved? There are multiple ways to manage this. One is that Red Hat ships the repository but disables it by default and then specifically excludes EPEL from the SLA like it does with the supplementary channel. If a customer chooses to enable it, then they are aware of the benefit and risks involved. Rahul